Environment Committee on June 5th, 2018

[Daniel Watson]

I'm not aware of any authority that would allow the minister to approve drilling outside the park. I'm also not aware of any drilling authorizations inside the park. In fact, I'm almost certain that nothing could be described in this way, unless I'm forgetting something. However, no drilling is done inside the park and the minister does not have the authority to authorize drilling outside the park.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

There isn't any inside the park, obviously. However, according to the information we received, authorizations covering areas near the island and the park were granted to British Petroleum. This worries many citizens who want to protect this gem. I would ask you, if possible, to do the necessary checks and forward the relevant documents to the committee afterwards.

[Daniel Watson]

Yes, but I can assure that I'm not aware of any authorization my minister has given for drilling off Sable Island National Park Reserve.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Very well.

With regard to the greenhouse gas reduction targets that we presented at the Paris Agreement, everyone seems to agree that we are behind schedule and that we will not achieve them. That was the opinion of the Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development last year. She predicted that we would miss our 2020 targets and that we would very likely miss our 2030 targets if no adjustment was made. The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development, or OECD, is also concerned that Canada may not meet its commitments and objectives. This is also what the United Nations expressed in a report only a few months ago.

Unfortunately, the minister seems to be the only one who believes that she will achieve these objectives. I know that you aren't political leaders, but I would like to know what you have to say to everyone who thinks we won't succeed in meeting our commitments.

[Stephen Lucas]

In 2016, the government and my staff worked hard to develop, in collaboration with the provinces, territories, indigenous peoples, businesses, civil society, young Canadians and all other Canadians, a plan to achieve our 2030 Paris Accord target, promote economic growth and increase Canada's resilience to real climate change.

This plan, published in December 2016 and sent to the United Nations, will inform Canadians of the measures and the effects they will have produced each year by 2030. As I just said, the plan also contains non-modelled measures, because we are developing rules to account for the effects of these measures on land use, carbon storage in Canada's forests and agricultural areas, and the further reduction of greenhouse gas emissions through public transit, which is a high priority for Quebec.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Okay, thank you.

Unfortunately, the Liberal government eliminated the public transit tax credit. I think it does one thing on one side and the opposite on the other, as happens too often.

We have just collectively become the owners of a pipeline, which is a big surprise for many people. We don't know how much it will cost us. This acquisition cost $4.5 billion, and its expansion will likely cost $7.4 billion. This pipeline will transport raw bitumen, which is extremely difficult to recover in the event of a spill because it sinks. We will triple the production of fossil fuel energy, which means putting three million more cars on the road.

By making such decisions, which go completely in the opposite direction from the goals set, how is it possible that Canada will achieve its objectives, which it is already at risk of not achieving?

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

You have 12 seconds.

[Stephen Lucas]

The government has assessed the direct greenhouse gas emissions that will result from the Trans Mountain pipeline expansion project, as well as those from upstream oil production. These emissions are reflected in the National Energy Board's forecasts and in the modelling of our targets.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Thank you for that. I gave a little extra time to get the answers.

Next up is Mr. Aldag.

[John Aldag, Liberal, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

Thank you.

I will start off with a question for Mr. Watson. It's building a bit on where my colleague Mr. Amos was going on how we're moving forward on meeting the 2020 targets, particularly looking at the 17% terrestrial.

I'm interested that within Parks Canada.... We heard of great examples of work that is under way right now for the creation of parks when our minister was here, and lots of really exciting work that's happening for both terrestrial and marine. I wonder if you could provide a comment for us more on the front end of the intake process. We know that there are still some zones in Canada that are not represented and where target areas have not yet been identified.

I'm wondering if you have the capacity for the science or the research, the discussions, for the planning of the next round of intakes through the budget that you've been allocated here.

[Daniel Watson]

Thank you very much for the question.

In fact, the latest budget will add nearly 200 FTEs into the science component of Parks Canada, which is a very significant contribution. That will play out in a number of very important ways. When it comes to protection, it's not just the number of square kilometres that are important, but it's where those square kilometres are and what they protect. You can only understand that with really solid science.

The other part that's important, which I think everybody who has been in this business has learned over the years, is that what is up against that can either help or limit the degree of protection you do inside your own areas. With this increased science, we will be better able to talk to first nations, to Métis, to Inuit, to provinces, to territories, and better able to talk to regional and municipal governments. In all of those instances, the science should lead us all to better decisions, better interconnectivity, and better protection.

[John Aldag, Liberal, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

Great.

I'd also like to get your thoughts, briefly, on the national historic sites side of the program, and how you're resourced right now. I know that work has happened over the last few years on improving condition reports, and the condition of built heritage in Canada. How is the agency poised right now to continue advancing the work on the federally held, and particularly the Parks Canada-held national historic sites, federal heritage buildings, classified and recognized FHBRO buildings, and those types of areas? Are you able to move forward on some of the work you need to do on improving conditions?

[Daniel Watson]

Thank you for the question.

We obviously take very close note of the report this committee did on cultural heritage. We're following that very closely.

I have a couple of concrete things—no pun intended—on the protection of cultural heritage sites. First and foremost, we are responsible for some of the most iconic cultural heritage sites in the country. The monies we've had in recent budgets have allowed us to do several billion dollars' worth of work to protect that. I think that's setting a solid example across the country.

In terms of the work with other jurisdictions, we are not only working with them on maintaining at least a modest level of this year's cost-sharing program, but the minister has written to her colleagues across the country, following the report this committee did. I will actually be attending a meeting of deputy ministers and ministers in Yellowknife very shortly, and will be speaking to this topic as well.

We did something that we're taking very seriously, and we will look forward to continued work on this now that we have more to do.

[John Aldag, Liberal, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

It's wonderful to hear you'll be there at the meeting. I have also met personally with a number of colleagues at the provincial and territorial level. They felt that it was very important to have the minister responsible for built heritage at those meetings. I'm delighted that you'll be attending.

Mr. Hallman, I'd like to turn to you for a moment.

We have Bill C-69 working its way through the House. Could you provide a comment or two on the impact that Bill C-69 may have on the required spending authorities of the agency that you're responsible for in 2018-19. Are you poised to move forward?

[Ron Hallman, President, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency]

Budget 2018 did provide for up to $259 million of additional resources over five years for the agency to transition to the new impact assessment agency of Canada to enhance indigenous outreach and engagement, to effect the early planning aspects of the bill, and to work with proponents, provinces, indigenous groups, and other interested parties to build greater certainty up front of the process. Those monies will flow over the period of five years, as laid out in the budget. The first part of that will come to the agency later in the year, through supplementary estimates.

[John Aldag, Liberal, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

Thank you.

I'm not sure who's responsible for the species at risk program, but I put a question to the parliamentary secretary and in 10 seconds he gave a fairly tight answer. I wonder if there's any further information that you can provide. Essentially, the question was this: How will budget 2018 transform the way that Canada protects our species at risk?

[Stephen Lucas]

Thank you.

The budget represents a really significant investment in protecting nature, both through protected areas and species at risk. As Daniel noted, it recognizes the benefit for those species of protected areas, particularly in areas of high biodiversity value where connectivity is key, and in terms of measures to protect critical habitat. The budget will allow us to work in partnership with provinces and territories, landowners, industry, and indigenous groups to focus on priority places and to take a more place-based approach to species at risk—for example, in the south of the divide area in southern Saskatchewan. We will also look at critical anchor species that are in areas that touch on many different species at risk. An example is caribou, where we are working in partnership with the provinces and territories, industry, local communities, and indigenous groups to support protection of critical habitat.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

I'm going to have end it there because we're running over. Sorry.

I hate doing that, but once it gets past a little bit, I have to cut you off.

One thing I always do, and didn't do earlier, was introduce members who aren't normally at the table. I just wanted to recognize Stephanie Kusie and Michael Levitt for joining us today.

Now we're over to Monsieur Godin.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

First, I would like to thank our witnesses for being here this morning. I apologize for the first part of the meeting, where people were emotional and partisan. I know you rise above that. Members of the Conservative Party have great respect for senior public servants. Thank you for being here and answering our questions.

Next, I would like to ask Mr. Watson a very simple question about Parks Canada.

The budget indicates that there will be an increase of $83.6 million. If I recall correctly, in her presentation, the minister talked about the possibility of creating new parks in Canada. Did I understand correctly?

[Daniel Watson]

Thank you very much for the question.

We are still working on a system plan that will ultimately cover all of Canada's ecoregions. We haven't finished this task, and it won't be done any day now. Unfortunately, a lot of time is needed, but we continue to work on new parks, especially in the south Okanagan region, as the minister mentioned, and the Thaidene Nene project in the Northwest Territories. We are also holding discussions in other parts of the country.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Watson.

If you're ever looking for a suitable place, I would say this: Canadians living in the Quebec City area unfortunately don't have access to parks managed by the Parks Canada Agency because there aren't any nearby. But I would like to suggest a place in the beautiful riding of Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, the historic site of Fort Jacques-Cartier-et-du-Manoir-Allsopp, which straddles the municipalities of Cap-Santé and Donnacona. We would be very happy to welcome you there. If you have any ideas, please contact us.

[Daniel Watson]

In the meantime, I will tell you that La Mauricie National Park, about an hour and a half away, is fantastic.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

That's true. We want to be attractive.

Thank you very much.

My next question is for Mr. Lucas.

The budget indicates that $14.5 million is being provided to support the implementation of the pan-Canadian framework. There was a meeting between the provinces and the federal government. Will $14.5 million be used for management and coordination or is it cost-shared with the provinces?

Could you tell us what you're going to do with the $14.5 million?

[Stephen Lucas]

Yes.

This funding will allow our employees to advance some of the measures contained in the pan-Canadian framework, as you mentioned. This includes the use of funds to support adaptation to the impacts of climate change, to develop regulatory frameworks in the electricity sector, and to enable research and development related to the regulatory framework in the transportation sector.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

If I understand correctly, this means adding employees who will follow up on the accountability and instructions given by the provinces. Is that correct?