Environment Committee on Nov. 29th, 2016

[Stephen Laskowski]

Well, I don't think you can characterize it with a description. When I told the story, it was about a level of frustration within the industry, and they've reached a point, whether it's their drivers, whether it's their customers, or whether it's a combination of both.... I don't think you can characterize it by saying certain types of individuals would motivate themselves towards the defeat devices. I do want to say that I don't make excuses for this. They're breaking the law. It's the background for why this is happening.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

But you're very adamant about it. The way you express yourself, you're talking about a group out here that is defeating the system.

[Stephen Laskowski]

That's correct.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Are they the ones who, because the margins are so tight, are trying to get around the margins? They're working for companies; they're not independents. You're talking about companies that are finding a way to defeat this.

[Stephen Laskowski]

I'm glad you brought up margins. On average, for example, a class 1 railway's operating ratio would be 0.67 or 0.68. A good ratio for a trucking company is 0.97. That's 3¢.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Yes.

[Stephen Laskowski]

That's for everybody. To your point on the margins, that's what motivates. You're getting to the point where it's what can they do to stay in business? Again, that doesn't justify it, because the vast majority are dealing with it, and we're dealing with the competitive issues plus the environmental issue. Those aren't excuses, but I'm saying to the committee that we can deal with this in its entirety.

You change CEPA, and let's make sure we're dealing with this. Let's make sure we have a strong warranty recall system. Let's also make sure that trucks coming up into Canada can actually work in our cold weather.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Historically, when rules get tighter and the margins are tighter, the underground economy grows. You're going to drive it underground if that margin's too tight. They're going to find a way underground unless you work with them.

[Stephen Laskowski]

I think that laws are in place to ensure that 99% in society are compliant. I think we can never worry about that 1% who go underground, but I think—

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I would accept that—

[Stephen Laskowski]

—we definitely need to have a law in place.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I accept that, but you had a lot of focus on that—

[Stephen Laskowski]

Yes.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

—so I was thinking this was a big concern for you, and you're worried about that 1% a whole lot. Now you're talking about what the 99% are doing right rather than focusing on the 1%.

[Stephen Laskowski]

Well, I think that as a society, an association, and a democracy, we pride ourselves in upholding the law.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Yes.

[Stephen Laskowski]

When we have a black hole like this, it's time for government to step in to ensure that laws are enforced for everyone.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I would agree It's just that the tone of your conversation was focused on the 1%, and I'm going—

[Stephen Laskowski]

I can you give you an example of the irritant for the other 99%.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I know it's an irritant.

[Stephen Laskowski]

It's rubbed in their face. There are full-page ads out on the Internet and in magazines for these devices.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Okay.

[Stephen Laskowski]

If you're a business owner and you're struggling along with 20% extra vehicles, and your drivers are having issues, and your customers are...and you're looking there and you're doing the right thing, and it's there right in front of you, you have a right, as a business owner, to go to government. You have an obligation to stop this. What I'm saying to the committee is that you have an obligation to stop this.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Now I'm getting to what you really wanted to say. I appreciate that, because what you're looking at is the 1% that's not safe.

[Stephen Laskowski]

It's not safe. It's not following the rules, and it's looking for ways, despite the frustration, to get around the system. It's not right.