Environment Committee on Oct. 21st, 2022

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Thank you.

Former member of Parliament Cheryl Hardcastle introduced me to the Caldwell First Nation when the port authority was looking to sell Ojibway Shores, which is the shoreline area. Caldwell First Nation had just gotten their settlement.

For a little more background, Caldwell First Nation fought with the British to protect the country. I mentioned briefly that they were supposed to get Point Pelee. They didn't get it, so they went through the courts and a whole series of things. Now it's part of a whole beautiful reconciliation process because they set up an agreement with Ontario Hydro with regard to being respected there. They were involved in also helping move the Stellantis plant and other types of development projects that we have.

It was a different scenario when I took over as member of Parliament in 2002 from what it is today. We've worked on a series of projects together, including discussing issues of the Jay Treaty. They're making progress on that as well.

I just talked to Chief Mary Duckworth yesterday. She's been here on the Hill with me, presenting this as a national urban park. It was several years ago, before COVID. She's been with me on this, front and centre, for a long period of time.

As a member of that area, with this being introduced where we didn't have that chapter, I think it's been really special. In fact, I brought one of my publications. I don't know if you're familiar with all these things. This is for educating my constituents on Caldwell First Nation. It was a direct flyer because it's a new chapter for us in our area.

It's really special because it's working out well. They've been part of all the town halls and all the consultation. That's why they support the bill.

One last thing is that, through them, we were able to get Wyandotte Nation on the U.S. side to support this bill as well.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

That is great to hear.

You mentioned a bit the potential for co-management. Can you talk about what that opportunity is and the importance of co-management?

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Co-management is part of the truth and reconciliation view that Chief Duckworth has. In fact, we had a town hall meeting over the summer about this. The focus was on co-management with the public. We had about 300 people show up to the event.

Part of it, which is in my publication here, is to get people used to that. It goes beyond just reacting and consulting. It's actually about being participants in how to use the property and how to engage with the property.

This property doesn't have the access for hunting and fishing. It's too small for that, but it's a significant enough property for the ecosystem. It's going to be very important. How they view it, and the exciting part for me, is that we have a lot of terrible situations to deal with for our first nations, but this is one where a light is being shone in a very positive way.

The first time I met Chief Duckworth was when they were left out of consultations for the original Gordie Howe bridge, so I brought them down to the community benefits event and we crashed it together. That's kind of how we got to know each other. They were left off the invitation list and I invited them to come down.

It's been a great relationship. I know the government is making some good relationships with them as well. She was just recently on the Hill here, too. It's been a really good news story.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Thanks so much.

You mentioned, in your opening remarks and responses to other committee members, the Detroit River international wildlife conservation area and how it could be connected to the Ojibway national urban park. I know that you are also our Great Lakes critic, a long-time member of the Canada-United States Inter-Parliamentary Group and the U.S. border critic. You have significant involvement and relationship with our friends south of the border.

Can you talk a bit about the opportunity the Ojibway national urban park and the Detroit River international wildlife conservation area present for the Great Lakes region and for the relationship between our two countries?

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

This is another good one, because Vance Badawey, a member of Parliament, has been really good at working on the Great Lakes. In fact, we worked together. I'm one of the vice-chairs of the Canada-U.S. parliamentary association, and Vance helped trail-blaze. We have a special component for the Great Lakes, now. We've been lobbying in Washington. Prior to that, it was always hit-and-miss. I was always pushing against issues, here and there. Now, it's actually a part of the function of the Canada-U.S. parliamentary association, which is excellent.

I've been working with Senator Gary Peters for years. I've known Rashida Tlaib for a long time, like I said, and Stephanie Chang. There's a lot of activity in the U.S.

In fact, they're looking at Canada, and they're not very pleased about our Great Lakes investment, right now. They're putting in hundreds of millions of dollars. They're also concerned about the DGR, which is a nuclear waste depository project in the Huron area. There have been concerns raised about that. They would like to see us be more progressive.

The interesting thing about this project is that we need to have hot spot zones in the U.S. for the species migrating back into Canada or the United States. That's what this location does: Point Pelee and Rondeau parks, all the way up here, then back into the United States.

Lastly, to conclude, this is also uniting citizens on both sides, as well as NGOs. The Great Canadian Trails will now go over into the United States. It was announced three weeks ago. The Canadian trails will go into the U.S., and the U.S. cycling.... All the different sponsors, groups and organizations came over for that announcement. There were a number of people. Our trail system will go into the U.S. Maybe some people on our border aren't as familiar with how.... That's just the way we are. They're our cousins, and we're their cousins.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Wonderful.

You just mentioned Point Pelee National Park, with which you're very familiar. You have talked to me about the ecotourism that's grown significantly, related to that park, especially with regard to birding.

Could you talk a little more about that?

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

That's where we're lucky. I don't know if people are aware, but Richard Cannings is an ornithologist. I didn't even know what the heck that was—a bird guy. We have a resident bird guy. He came down to the area and toured it with me. He also went out to the Leamington area for the hawk festival. There's been a real explosion with regard to this, which has been really great.

There are a couple of other properties outside of that. Once we get this defined, we might have better consensus in terms of increasing the spots. Again, as a former conservation vice-chair, I know people get on board when they see something solid and know it's going to last. Ecotourism is huge. I'd love for it to be part of a repertoire of places people could visit or stop at—not just Point Pelee, which is getting active and busy. Either open up more spots for business, or we might have restrictions in the future. This is a great spot for business.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

I think I'm getting close to the end of my time, but I would like to know a little about how the Ojibway national urban park would help with adapting to or mitigating climate change in the Windsor area.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

You have 10 seconds or less.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

For flooding...it's the easiest one, in our area. It's a great sponge and we need it, especially for the town of LaSalle and other places. It's an important sponge. The businesses.... It's the same thing, because they're flooded.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Thank you.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

I'll ask a bit more in my next round.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Okay.

We'll go to the second round, a four-minute round.

Go ahead, Mr. Epp, for four minutes, please.

[Dave Epp, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Leamington, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I appreciate the opportunity.

Serendipity has allowed me to sub in today, which makes it three-quarters of the Windsor-Essex members of Parliament having the opportunity to speak to this.

One of the disadvantages of going in the second round is that many of the topics one wants to cover were covered before. I'm going to have you retrace a bit of ground, because I have some similar lived experience.

Living in Windsor and Essex County...our American friends are on three sides of us. Can you talk a little more about the opportunities? I'm heavily influenced. I'm a diehard, in terms of our national sport. I'm a Toronto Maple Leafs fan. I have to be, but I'm also a Detroit Lions and Detroit Tigers fan. I'm sorry, Blue Jays.

This park establishes another cross-border opportunity. I have attended the freedom fireworks and the Gordie Howe International Bridge. There are all sorts of other international co-operations.

Can you expound a little more on this? I know you talked a little about the walking and bike paths. What else does this do, culturally, because we are so intertwined? I have the Point Pelee park in my riding, so I have a lot of Detroit cottagers on the way to the Point Pelee park. What does this expand?

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Epp.

First of all, I'm a Blue Jays fan, and after that last game, we still have to apologize. It didn't work out so well.

Thank you for your work. We've seen highly industrialized areas, and also agriculture. We had to work back. We've been doing those things, but our connections to the United States, as you mentioned, are so imperative. It's been hard over the last number of years. We have family members. I'm not sure people are aware of the connections. You almost have to experience it. The area that's next to this in my riding goes through a lot. There are 40,000 cars and 10,000 trucks per day that go through right next to Sandwich Town, and half of that traffic is family, friends, businesses and colleagues. We really suffered.

With regard to the western hemisphere travel initiative, that was when the U.S. first introduced passports. A lot of U.S. citizens didn't want to get passports. A lot of U.S. citizens haven't come because of other issues, and this is a way of bringing some of them back.

It's also economics. We know that the tool and die and the trade industries, when they go back and forth, get us contracts. We get developments and we get all kinds of synergies, so if we miss out on those, it would be awful.

We even had tours before COVID for people to come for the Underground Railroad to find where their relatives ended up, because many of them fled the United States to come to Canada, and there were a number of tourism initiatives just to deal with that.

[Dave Epp, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Leamington, ON]

Thank you.

In a previous life, I worked with the Foodgrains Bank, and we established a growing project, which we have across Canada, in one of our other urban parks, Rouge River park in Toronto. Rouge River park—I'm familiar with it—has throughways through it. We're farming inside that park, and we have transportation inside that park.

Can you talk about some of the unique aspects of having an urban park here in Ojibway?

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

You're absolutely correct, and I've toured the Rouge. The Rouge came up in our original meeting, so I've been out there a number of times.

You're absolutely right. It shows you that you can live and develop your ecosystems within an urban area. When there are issues related to industry and ecosystems, there can be solutions, and that's what I'm really excited about with the Rouge. What they've been doing is that they have, as you mentioned, roadways, and they have multi-faceted types of activity taking place, and that's what we need, but we need a good business plan, and we need an accountable business plan.

I like this legislation because it also requires you to come back at a series of points in time with public consultation as the plan evolves, develops and goes forward, including submitting accountability to Parliament. Another thing that's different is that we have to do that.

Those are the reasons I think it's important.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

You're pretty much done.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

I'm sorry, Mr. Epp.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Mr. Longfield, you have four minutes, please.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Masse, it's great to see you at the table. We served on the industry committee together back in the 42nd Parliament, and I always enjoy working with you.

I want to come back to Parks Canada. You mentioned just now about Rouge, and that was a park that was turned over to Parks Canada in 2017 with a new process for establishing urban national parks.

The private member's bill we have in front of us seems to be on a parallel track to the consultation process that Parks Canada has been following, as you know, taking 20 opportunities and narrowing them down. Saskatoon is in the running. We have Windsor in the running, but landing on Windsor was an opportunity through the consultation process with Parks Canada.

Could you comment on that process? You said earlier that it's not really clear what that process is, and we'll ask Parks Canada, I'm sure, in a future part of the study, but could you maybe comment on the existing consultation process?

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Thanks, Mr. Longfield, and, yes, it's always been a pleasure to serve.

I think it's a good and fair question. We started this process before the process that Parks Canada is doing, before they did their thing, and that came out just previous to an election. It was announced, and then they've been having meetings with different groups and organizations, which is good. There's been some recent movement since we tabled the legislation.

I got drawn at the top of the legislation tree, so to speak, and I could have chosen something else that would have been maybe easier to get—

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

To be fair, that process is ongoing. To be fair, they didn't pick it up because of your private member's bill.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Yes, well, some of it started, but we.... Anyway, we're not privy to all those meetings and discussions; we get them from third parties after they happen.

The differences I'm looking for are in the full process for the future as well, and that's why the legislation was put forth. It's going to include accountability through the parks act, and that's kind of really where we see it.

We asked the drafters of the legislation about the best way to enshrine this as a park and have it consistent, because right now every park has to have its own legislation. That's the way it works.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you.

I feel like I'm in your role and you're in Navdeep Bains' role in INDU, as I recall. I'm just trying to get in as many questions as I can.

You mentioned the Caldwell First Nation. I'm aware that Walpole Island First Nation is also within the region. Have you done any consultation work with Walpole?