Environment Committee on Nov. 20th, 2025

[Keith Stewart]

Absolutely. B.C. and Quebec, the provinces that led on electric vehicles, are saying that they will follow. Federal leadership here is now key. I think that's why the work of this committee is really important, as is the input you give to the review that's ongoing. In one sense, it makes sense to have a national standard across the country. We have this pattern in Canada where provinces often take the lead initially. Frankly, B.C. and Quebec have done this a lot in the environmental field. Then we try to level that up at the national level.

I'm really hoping that the federal government will actually take up that mantle and lead and will not allow us to fall back on this. It is so important for our long-term greenhouse gas emissions reductions and for making healthier cities, cleaner air and reducing the costs for people to get around.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

What do you think is fuelling opposition to this standard, Mr. Stewart?

[Keith Stewart]

Part of it is coming from companies that have an existing business model and don't want to change. They want to keep out these new competitors. We're seeing a lot of disruption around the world where electrification is taking out incumbent industries. It's not just in transportation. It's also in things like heat pumps. In Ontario, there's a whole issue around the Ford government keeping out heat pumps after an Ontario Energy Board decision. On that desire to keep out new competitors that are seeking to actually transform the energy system, frankly, governments shouldn't be backing the incumbents there. They should be looking at what will be best for the long term for society.

Some of it is also coming from the defence of oil and gas, because this is an existential threat to the oil and gas industry. When you start looking at what people are calling the “electrotech revolution”, you can see that before there were things we could only do with oil and gas. We can now do them with electricity. If you're an oil and gas producer, that is a big threat. You're going to throw all the resources you can at blocking this. I mean, to be honest, if I were them, I'd be doing that. I'm not them, but that's a rational response. The goal of our elected officials is to look at what's best for Canada, not what's best for the bottom line of Exxon.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Thank you.

I have a quick question for Mr. Allan.

The International Energy Agency said that, I think, about 20% of vehicle sales last year were electric. It's anticipated to be about 25% this year, and I believe 40% by 2030.

Can you maybe comment on that, and do you see similar trends in Canada?

As well, tied to that, what impact does that have for charging infrastructure within Canada?

[Travis Allan]

Canada has been so successful at making the transition to electric vehicles. As I said, our estimate suggests there are around one million Canadians who've chosen EVs by now. That's based on some forecasting.

I think, fundamentally, it's because the technology is so much better, and my fellow witness here has just explained the efficiency benefits, the performance benefits and the low maintenance benefits of EV. We know this is happening, and we know it's happening on a global basis.

We're in this together, so the question is how we make sure that Canadians are ready to adopt EVs, save from EVs and have the charging stations in place. I think that's really the focus we have.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

You mentioned one million electric vehicles, citing a September 5 press release from the Canadian Charging Infrastructure Council. You talk about the “long-term policy certainty” to attract private investments.

Could you provide a copy of that press release to this committee?

I found it interesting in the release that you mentioned the one million vehicles, but you also cited a parliamentary budget office forecast. Can you provide that forecast and quickly speak to that, with 20 seconds to go?

[Travis Allan]

Absolutely.

I believe what you're referring to looked at the implications of how significant the EVAS would be for charging, and I just want to make sure I have the right note here. I'm happy to provide that and to tell you that as a general matter, the EVAS has been thoroughly reviewed and has a strong impact on charging and vehicle availability.

[The Chair, Liberal, Angelo Iacono]

Thank you very much, Mr. Allan.

Mr. Bonin, you have two and a half minutes.

[Patrick Bonin, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Allan, do you think more investment is needed, particularly from the federal government, for the charging network? Is it “investment”, as the government likes to call it, rather than spending?

[Travis Allan]

We also see them as investments, and I think there are two areas that are critical.

The good news is that for Canadians who can charge at home, with a detached house or driveway, there is really very little issue. We just want to make sure it supports the grid. We have that tech already. When you're talking about public areas and about people who live in condominiums and stratas, these are areas where the economics are still challenging. There is a very useful role, in addition to the EVAS, for a tax credit that can work to support the economics. That's what my members would tell you. We're trying to figure out a way to get these financial statements to work and just unlock private capital.

We can do that with a clean technology ITC that works for on-road transportation, for public charging, and also for multi-unit residential buildings, which currently would not be eligible. That would make a huge difference.

[Patrick Bonin, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Allan.

Mr. Stewart, the Canadian Climate Institute published a report showing that Canada is not on track to meet its 2030 greenhouse gas emissions reduction targets.

Would the absence of a standard on the availability of electric vehicles complicate things even further? For example, if there's a new pipeline or we increase the output of a pipeline, would that make emissions reduction efforts in transportation even more critical?

[Keith Stewart]

The electric vehicle availability standard is key for reducing long-term emissions from transportation. It's the kind of thing that has an enormous cumulative impact. As a vehicle fleet turns over, in the first few years you don't see big reductions, but then you see really big ones.

In terms of definitely getting to our longer-term climate goals, the electric vehicle standard is key. One thing, I think, that is really challenging right now is that we're seeing some backtracking on some of the existing policies at the federal level, which already weren't going to achieve our stated climate goal, but if we build another new pipeline, it's only going to be built with public money in some way or another. They might find creative ways to subsidize it, over enormous resistance—

[The Chair, Liberal, Angelo Iacono]

Thank you, Mr. Stewart.

The floor is yours for five minutes, Mr. Bexte.

[David Bexte, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, witnesses, for being here today, and all committee members. I really appreciate your time and your commitment to show up. It makes a difference.

Mr. Allan, I'd like to follow up on a couple of things you talked about. A rough estimate is about $100,000 per charger.

What is the split if that was...? Is there a rural/urban difference?

[Travis Allan]

We talked to our members and asked them to estimate across their public fast-charging deployments and they came up with an average of $125,000.

You're going to find that it is most expensive in places where there are major power upgrades, so urban—

[David Bexte, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I'm sorry, I'm going to ask you to hurry because I'm short on time.

[Travis Allan]

My apologies.

If you have a rural place with very low electrical service, that will cost more, but it's going to be the most in Toronto or Vancouver.

[David Bexte, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Okay, so would it be double?

[Travis Allan]

It could potentially be.

[David Bexte, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Okay, it can easily double.

These also happen to be the places with the lowest population distribution and the highest electricity costs and the lowest transmission generation availability.

Could you square that off a little bit?

[Travis Allan]

I think you're going to see a lot of plug-in hybrids in rural Canada.

[David Bexte, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you very much. I appreciate that.

Mr. Little, I wonder if you could expand on the dynamic between Canada and the U.S.

The auto industry is very integrated and this is a feature of geography. There's nothing we can do about our proximity to the U.S. and for as far as I think we can imagine into the future we're going to be connected to the U.S. economy in a very significant way. I think it's a fallacy to think that we can just ignore them.

Could you speak about what Canada could do to try to insulate ourselves or run our own show?

[Eric Little]

Of course. Thank you very much. It's a great question.

We've actually seen other jurisdictions around the world be quite flexible in how they approach this unique problem. That is allowing multiple certification standards internationally. Therefore the Euro standard, which is, by the way, the largest standard used throughout the world, could potentially be employed in Canada in collaboration with the EPA. This is actually what Australia does.

In my brief, the committee can review how this very successful example can be leveraged in Canada to make sure that we have an even playing field and that we have more choice for the consumer ultimately.

[David Bexte, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

In your discussions, did the ECCC ever imply at all that resistance—the second order—from U.S. companies in the auto industry was a factor in...?

[Eric Little]

I'd say the factor would be that updating our regulation to allow the European standard, which, I want to mention again, is the largest throughout the world, and creates a very competitive engine market, would be challenging—that would be a word to use—however, there's significant opportunity.