Information & Ethics Committee on Feb. 14th, 2008

[Stevie Cameron]

Well, by the time Harvey and I finished this book and it was published in 2001, all we knew was what this committee knows now. We knew that the diaries of Mr. Schreiber and the bank accounts we had showed money put into the Britan account of $500,000. And it showed the meetings that were set up between the men, which you all know about, and the withdrawals of the $300,000 in four parts: $100,000, $100,000, $50,000, $50,000, and then $200,000 remained in the account. We took this story up to 2001.

[Carole Lavallée, Bloc, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

I'm asking you the question again. Before 1993, do you believe that Brian Mulroney received money directly or indirectly?

[Stevie Cameron]

Madame Lavallée, I didn't know. I had heard the rumours. My job was to try to find out what happened to the money, not necessarily going to Mr. Mulroney particularly, but what happened to the money. As I said, I took it to that point. We did have that information about the $500,000, the $300,000, and so on, but beyond that I have no evidence.

[Carole Lavallée, Bloc, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Do you believe that the money Brian Mulroney received, the $300,000, the $225,000 or the $250,000—we don't exactly know what the amount was—was intended to thank him for services previously rendered, or whether Mr. Schreiber really instructed Mr. Mulroney to represent Thyssen internationally?

[Stevie Cameron]

Madame Lavallée, I can't tell you that. I don't know the answer to that.

[Carole Lavallée, Bloc, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

You've nevertheless done a lot of research. You're one of the people in Canada who has gathered together the most information. You're a specialist in the Airbus-Mulroney affair. I understand that you don't really feel like sharing all your thoughts with us. It's nevertheless impossible for you not to have an idea on the subject. You must have thought about it. Can you share your thoughts with us?

[Stevie Cameron]

Madame Lavallée, I have thought about it. I lived this for many years. I'm very happy to be working on a serial killer.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[Stevie Cameron]

I'd tell you if I knew, if I had absolute knowledge, but I'm a journalist and I deal with the facts. As I told you in my introduction, my work hasn't been challenged, so it's important for me to tell you that I do not have more than I have. I have what I have. I haven't worked on this since 2001.

The CBC team has done a brilliant job of giving you more information. I think that's all I can say. In terms of the money that I saw Mr. Schreiber...what we now understand was given to Mr. Mulroney, I saw those withdrawals coming out of those accounts. I saw the set-up for meeting with Mr. Doucet. I saw many meetings with Mr. Doucet over the years--many. I have a lot of information on that, but in terms of what you really want to know, which is the money, what I have is what I have.

[Carole Lavallée, Bloc, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

A number of individuals have denied the information that you've published in your books. Has anyone previously sued you?

[Stevie Cameron]

No, nobody has ever sued me. Nobody has ever brought any action against me.

[Carole Lavallée, Bloc, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Do you believe that everything you've written is true and accurate?

[Stevie Cameron]

Yes, I do, Madame Lavallée. Yes, I do.

[Carole Lavallée, Bloc, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Do you believe that François Martin has two personalities: the one you knew and the one we knew?

[Stevie Cameron]

If you look in the transcript, you will see that he is quite upset at one point because he can't find work. He had a terrible time finding a job after he became public. This material in On the Take that he gave me was not the first time I'd interviewed him. I included a story in your package that I wrote for The Globe and Mail in 1990, where he says many of the same things.

He's a very talented, bright man. I liked him very much; I still like him. I think he's a good person. I think he was terrified.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

Mr. Martin, please.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you, Ms. Cameron, for being here.

Let me begin by saying thank you for the contribution you have made to the body of work we're dealing with today. I know we've all read your books, and we've all thought them very useful, at least as a base level of information, as a good starting point.

I also know it's been a great strain on you over the years. There's a website now being run by the PR firm that Brian Mulroney has hired. Virtually as we ask questions, it puts up its own sheets to try to discredit you and attack you in various ways. I understand that must be stressful.

Brian Mulroney said very clearly that he had absolutely nothing to do with the Airbus purchase, or the choice of Air Canada to purchase the Airbus product. Notwithstanding having the smoking gun, the silver bullet with you, do you believe in your own heart that there was political interference in the choice to purchase the Airbus product over the other airplanes that were being pitched to Air Canada at the time?

[Stevie Cameron]

Yes, Mr. Martin.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Do you believe that the Government of Canada should have settled the $2.1 million defamation suit against Brian Mulroney? Again, I'm asking for your personal opinion, Ms. Cameron, as something of an authority in the field.

[Stevie Cameron]

I'm a reporter. You're asking me to make judgment calls. Given what we all know now, I think it was not a smart decision.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

In your book On The Take you have a piece in which former Conservative cabinet minister Suzanne Blais-Grenier is testifying before a justice of the peace, dealing with a series of allegations really that Glen Kealey had made.

I have Glen Kealey's original transcript here and your document. This former Conservative cabinet minister testified to the existence of a secret PC fund that came from the mandatory 5% kickbacks extorted from businesses that won federal contracts. She said it was her belief that the money was routed to an offshore account, and she mentioned Luxembourg. I think we can probably safely assume she meant Liechtenstein.

Do you have any opinion on that?

[Stevie Cameron]

I interviewed her, and she was very upset. Her political career was ruined, as we know. I don't have any information. She told me that. I was not able to prove that, except that we did know that there was a toll on many of the contracts during those years.

You mentioned Glen Kealy. He was one of the prime examples of that. He was asked for 5% back on a contract that he had hoped to get with the government.

I met a number of people who talked about that 5%, or whatever the percentage was, for government contracts. Again and again and again I heard about that.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

You also document in your book that in her testimony to this justice of the peace in Ontario, she testified that the money, the 5% kickback, was for a retirement fund for Brian Mulroney. Do you remember her telling you that?

[Stevie Cameron]

I remember her telling me that, but I don't remember more than that.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you.

Regarding the RCMP, Ms. Cameron, I know you felt you had to take legal action and file a formal complaint against the RCMP because you felt you were threatened by a senior officer. You said he had made harmful statements about you and damaged your reputation and then suddenly turned around and withdrew one of the most key accusations, that you had met 686 times with the RCMP, when in actual fact it was a handful of times. Obviously you've given a great deal of thought to this, but what do you attribute this misinformation to? Why did the RCMP do so much personal damage to your reputation and your career?