Information & Ethics Committee on June 3rd, 2010

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Nepean—Carleton, ON]

You're right. And you can come to order whenever you're ready.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

Order. Mr. Poilievre, order, please.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Nepean—Carleton, ON]

It is a basic act of respect for you to inform somebody of their summons before you run to the media and attack them in that forum.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

Please turn off the microphone.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Nepean—Carleton, ON]

And now you want to silence us.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

With respect, Mr. Poilievre, you're making allegations against the chair. We should be dealing with the motion. I've given you great latitude, but I think you have gone way beyond where we should be.

We have a motion from Mr. Easter that the committee invite the Minister of Natural Resources to appear before the committee. I want to deal with that motion after we dispose of this matter. If it is the committee's wish, we can hear from the minister now.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Nepean—Carleton, ON]

We have points of order here, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

To finish my statement, I want the committee to understand that I've spoken to the minister and I've indicated to him that I would make every attempt to let him have an opportunity to be accountable before the committee.

Now, which one of you wanted...?

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

I raised a point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

Mr. Lukiwski, on a point of order.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

It's a procedural matter. I believe Mr. Poilievre had referenced it before you shut off his microphone. I would just like to ask a simple question of you, Chair, since I think it speaks to the essence of committees in general and the proper procedure and proper actions of the chair of a committee.

Did you in fact, Mr. Chair, speak to the media prior to informing Mr. Soudas that he would be summoned?

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

That he would be summoned?

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Did you speak to the media before you informed Mr. Soudas of the potential of him being summoned?

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

The potential.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

I'm not trying to parse words here, I'm just asking did you go to the media before you went to Mr. Soudas?

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

This is not, Mr. Lukiwski...

[Luc Desnoyers, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

A point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

Excuse me, Mr. Desnoyers, we are actually on a point of order. We can't have another one.

Mr. Lukiwski...

[Luc Desnoyers, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

We have a motion to debate, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

No. Order. Just a moment.

I have in writing, from the clerk, that on Monday I signed the summonses at one o'clock, and I got a response from the clerk that the summonses to Ms. Andrews and Mr. Soudas were being delivered that afternoon. And I heard—

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

When did you speak to the media?

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

Just a moment.

On Tuesday, the following day, in the evening, a media person asked me whether or not Mr. Soudas was being summoned. It is quoted--it's in the press, as the members know--that I indicated that I issued the summons. I did not receive the bailiff's report till this morning, and I spoke with the clerk about it. My statement was that I signed it. That's the truth: I signed it. There is no...

You will know, as well, Mr. Lukiwski, that the committee authorized the chair to issue those summonses if necessary. After I found out that there were... We called last Thursday to have him appear, with an e-mail. There was no response by the end of the day. We had a second one; there was no response by the end of the day. We waited until Monday, until noon. At noon, there was still no response from either of those requested witnesses. Accordingly, I asked the clerk to prepare the summonses and to bring them to me for signature and for service. That's how it happened, sir.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

I appreciate your explanation. To summarize, you spoke to the media before informing Mr. Soudas.

[The Chair, Liberal, Paul Szabo]

Is that a crime?

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

I'm asking whether that, in your opinion, sir, is proper procedure for any chair of any standing committee?