Evidence of meeting #31 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was communication.
A video is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
Were you to find an organization that you believe is exceeding the threshold and does not reply or does not reply positively to your letter, what's the remediation? What are the consequences?
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
Currently, I would do a preliminary assessment. If I had reason to believe they're not willing to comply or they're not complying, I would turn this into an investigation, because the threshold for investigation is that I have reason to believe it's necessary to ensure compliance. Then, if I have reason to believe an offence has occurred, I send it to the RCMP.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
How many cases are currently with the RCMP that you have referred to them?
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
How many are you able to tell me that you did advise us of during your last appearance before this committee?
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
I have forwarded three in this fiscal year. In my whole nine years, I've referred 19.
I'm not sure what I would have said. It's probably 17 or 18.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
They cleared a bunch of cases.
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
Yes. There have been two charges laid.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
When were those charges laid?
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
One in 2024, and the other one in 2022, I believe, or 2023.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
Of the four that are currently resting with the RCMP—
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
One of them is one of the charges that are laid. That case has not finished. It's still with the RCMP.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
Okay. That includes one—
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
That counts as one of them, and then there are three that they're investigating.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
For how long have they been with the RCMP?
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
It's in this last fiscal year.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
Those three are all within fiscal year 2025-26.
Conservative
Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands—Rideau Lakes, ON
Okay. There will be more questions to follow. Thank you, ma'am.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Brassard
Thank you, Mr. Barrett.
Before I go to Madame Lapointe, it's been standard practice at this committee that we reset the clock after the first hour. We're going to do six minutes, so that everybody has a second round of six-minute questions at the top of the hour.
Ms. Lapointe, you have the floor for six minutes.
Liberal
Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
Welcome back to our committee, Ms. Bélanger.
We are also very pleased to have you here today and to know that we will get your recommendations, as well as the explanations for all your recommendations, including the ones you submitted recently.
The last time you appeared here, you told us about the lobbying regime in British Columbia. You alluded to it in saying that it's an almost perfect model. The legislation, in British Columbia, has a registration threshold requirement, which is zero. Right now, you're talking about an eight-hour threshold. That means that, in British Columbia, lobbying must be registered as soon as it occurs. In addition, there is an exemption for small organizations with fewer than six employees.
What aspects of the British Columbia model do you think work especially well?
Are there any specific aspects that could realistically be adapted to our federal system?
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
The British Columbia regime is very forward-thinking. I think it's a model. I invite you to have representatives from British Columbia appear before you. They could help you with difficulties related to certain aspects.
In that province, a few things have been put in place that I find worthwhile and that I have noted in my recommendations.
Right now, we have an eight-hour threshold. The obligation applies when the lobbying activity is a significant part of the employee's duties. Therefore, I have to interpret the Lobbying Act to establish a value representing a “significant part”, and I gave it an eight-hour value.
British Columbia has registration by default, except for organizations with fewer than six members or those that spend less than 50 hours lobbying. However, these exceptions do not apply if the organization's main objective is to lobby and make representations.
We need to determine whether such an exclusion could be valid at the federal level. It may be valid. However, whenever a number of hours is associated with something, it always scares me because, once again, it's a sort of a threshold. There should really be objective criteria, such as the number of employees, or the number of lobbying activities provided for in the operational budget, which should be low. We should be careful when making exceptions, but we could certainly have some exceptions.
Would you like me to talk about other worthwhile aspects of the British Columbia system?
Liberal
Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
When you say “registration by default”, what exactly do you mean?
Commissioner of Lobbying, Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying
As stated on the first page of the document that was sent to you, as soon as there is a communication requesting a change regarding a registrable matter—a bill, regulations, a program, a policy, grants or contracts for consultant lobbyists—it is a lobbying communication and it should be entered in the registry. That's done by default. It's automatic.
This communication can take place verbally, in writing or through public announcements.
Liberal
Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
So the person who made the communication is responsible for registering with the registry of the Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying.
Is that correct?