Information & Ethics Committee on June 8th, 2026

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Do you think the committee should recommend adopting a default registration model for lobbyists here in Canada?

[Muhammad Ali]

We don't recommend a registration by default because there are situations, as I explained earlier, with certain organizations that may simply want to have a request to meet to seek help from an elected official. That is not a sustained lobbying effort.

What should be captured are sustained lobbying efforts because they demonstrate an actual effort by an organization to change government policy or at least advocate for it.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

I have another question regarding the distinction between salaried lobbyists and consulting lobbyists. Do you think there should be a distinction between the two?

[Muhammad Ali]

Yes, as the distinction exists currently, consultant lobbyists should be treated differently because they are paid to lobby on behalf of someone else. They should be required to register, no matter what. In-house lobbyists are what we recommend to maintain that threshold of significant part of duties.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

You wrote a briefing note that your organization submitted to the committee. It reads as follows: “From the outset, it is important to recognize that Canada already operates one of the most rigorous, transparent, and enforceable federal lobbying regimes in the world.” In fact, you referred to this earlier in your remarks.

Could you tell us more about this, give us some specific examples, and explain why this is the case?

[Muhammad Ali]

Certainly. If you look at the last 10 years, the number of issues that emerged were very small. When they did emerge as an issue, they were rightfully investigated by the commissioner and addressed appropriately, so the system is working.

Are tweaks needed? For sure. Tweaks can be made. However, our system, in comparison to other OECD...including even the G7, if you want to be more specific.... We do have one of the most rigorous systems in the world.

What are we trying to accomplish? Let's do things that achieve transparency but achieve the value of determining what lobbying is. Is this a sustained lobbying effort? The federal system is, by far, one of the most rigorous in the world.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Thank you, Mr. Ali.

Thank you, Ms. Lapointe.

Mr. Barsalou‑Duval, you have six minutes.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the members of the Standing Committee on Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics for having me here today.

I usually sit on the Standing Committee on Transport, Infrastructure and Communities, but for exceptional reasons, I'm here with you today. It must be said that the Standing Committee on Transport, Infrastructure and Communities has been at a complete standstill for the past month and a half, since the Liberal government forced an in camera meeting, which means that we can no longer move absolutely any of our work forward.

One of the things we were working on was the whole issue of the discount drivers, Drivers Inc., and in the course of the study we carried out and the work I did, I found all sorts of things that were very concerning and shocking. That is why I would like to move the following motion today:

Whereas, in the context of the study on the “Drivers Inc.” model conducted by the Standing Committee on Transport, Infrastructure and Communities (TRAN), the Canada Truck Operators Association (CTOA) is the only organization to have expressed explicit support for this model; Whereas the CTOA is the only organization to have refused to provide its membership list to the TRAN committee as part of the study; Whereas numerous Liberal elected officials and ministers have repeatedly appeared with members of the CTOA at public events or lobbying activities, including the organization's founding gala in 2023; Whereas the Chair of the TRAN committee attended a CTOA event where he was featured as one of the two headliners; Whereas Tejpreet Dulat, the CTOA's spokesperson, has been involved with the Liberal Party of Canada since 2015 and played a direct role in electing Mark Carney as Member of Parliament for Nepean and as Prime Minister; And whereas about 10 active members of the CTOA have contributed to the LPC's election fund by providing over $100,000 to the party since 2015; That the Standing Committee on Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics undertake a study on the links between the LPC and the CTOA.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Thank you, Mr. Barsalou‑Duval.

I just want to clarify one thing. You can't move a motion, but you can put it on notice. When you started, you said you wanted to move a motion, but you actually wanted to put it on notice. Do you understand?

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

My intention was to put it on notice. Is it necessary for me to read it again to officially put it on notice?

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

No, that's fine.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

The motion has been sent to the clerk, and it should be received—

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

That was my next question: Has the clerk also received the motion?

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

The motion has been sent to the clerk, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Okay. You have given notice of your motion. Thank you.

I will ask the clerk to send it to all members of the committee.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I would like—

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

You have the floor for two minutes and 45 seconds.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Actually, I'm going to let my colleague Rhéal Fortin ask the witnesses questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Okay.

Mr. Fortin, the floor is yours for two minutes and 35 seconds.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good afternoon, Mr. Ali.

One of the proposals was to consider board members as well as partners or sole proprietors as employees, which would require them to register as lobbyists for the company they represent.

I'd like to hear your opinion. Are there distinctions to be made? Do you agree with this? If there are nuances, please share them with us.

[Muhammad Ali]

Our recommendation is that, to help create clarity and consistency in the registry, paid board directors should be filed as employees in a company. Currently, they have to be registered as consultant lobbyists, which is completely separate. If you were to look online to, say, X, Y, Z company, but then there's a board director who's separate, you would have to go and find that to know what you're looking for. In order to ensure consistency and clarity, and to connect them, they should be listed as paid directors because they also benefit from the changes they're asking for.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Is there a distinction to be made between paid and unpaid board members? Similarly, if there is a distinction to be made, does that pay necessarily have to take the form of a cash payment, or could the payment of points or other benefits be considered remuneration under the Lobbying Act?

[Muhammad Ali]

As to the distinction between paid and unpaid, for the unpaid there may be some basic stipends that are provided for travel, but as long as they're not paid they are not benefiting financially from a decision from the group, so they should not be required to register, whereas the paid ones, who are paid to be on the board, are financially benefiting from the decision. Our recommendation is that separation should be based on whether you financially benefit or not, so those who are not paid to be on the board should remain not required to register, while the ones who are paid to be on the board should be required to.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Thank you.