Finance Committee on Sept. 21st, 2017

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Thank you.

I'd like to begin with Mr. Marcoux.

You said in your opening remarks that you have received thousands of letters and emails—presumably from your membership—that raised concerns about the tax changes that were announced. You pointed out that this is the most significant tax change in 45 years, done with 75 days of consultation, which you have characterized as inadequate.

I'd like you to share with us, if you can, some examples of some of the items, even by anecdote, that your members have shared in these letters and emails. I'll let you pass on some of the concerns that were raised.

[Dr. Laurent Marcoux]

Thank you.

This news led to an immediate reaction. People called us. That said, I think senior management would be better able to share details in this regard. I'll ask Mr. Feeley to answer you. His answer will be more specific than mine would be.

[John Feeley]

Thank you.

Some examples would be how physicians have been responding. In terms of seniors care, we talked earlier about moving more care into the community, and how hospitals are also moving more care into the community. Physicians are responding to that, in some cases, by expanding their practices, the footprint of their practices, and bringing more people or staff into their practices. They're making those investments in their medical practices, within a certain framework, and they're concerned. This change creates a lot of uncertainty, and they're wondering whether they are making the right decisions.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Did any say that they have an immediate plan to either modify, cancel, scale back, or otherwise not continue with a community-based practice?

[John Feeley]

We did some survey research, and certainly trainees are questioning whether or not to enter into community-based practice. As well, there are others who would move more quickly into, say, retirement.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

I will not take time from you, Pat, but I want to point out that proposals for tax changes have been announced and consultations are ongoing until October 2. I don't want anybody watching this committee to believe that the tax changes have been announced. There are consultations on the proposals.

Pat.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Thank you.

With that, perhaps, I will then move to Mr. Alexander.

I noted that in your remarks you mentioned the necessity of a competitive and stable tax environment in a fiscal environment. You spoke of stability being critical for driving prosperity and economic growth. Would you characterize...? We have had the announcement of a change. That is, again, the largest in 45 years, announced with 75 days of consultation. Is that the type of stable tax environment you think would help drive prosperity in Canada?

[Craig Alexander]

Obviously, from a business planning point of view, businesses like to have a good idea of what the tax system is going to look like so they can build their plans and make their decisions. When tax changes are considered, their full implications need to be considered, and also the timing of the implementation to give businesses an opportunity to adjust to tax changes.

My remarks were primarily focused not on the proposals currently being considered but, in general, on maintaining a competitive tax landscape. One of the things I am concerned about is that, ultimately, we will see tax reform in the United States and I am concerned it could put Canada in a less competitive situation.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Elimination of the dividend credit would raise small business income tax up to, in effect, a rate of 73%. Is that competitive?

[Craig Alexander]

The Conference Board hasn't done an analysis on it.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Last, I'll move on to the deficit situation.

You acknowledge the reasonableness of running deficits during a recession and, indeed, generally the political demand to do so. Yet we have not had a recession and have gone into a significant deficit. How do you characterize this as contributing to the stability necessary for prosperity?

[Craig Alexander]

When the Canadian economy is weak, when you are in a recession, fiscal policy can be very effective in helping mitigate the degree of impact of the business cycle.

The Canadian economy in 2014 suffered a very severe commodity shock. Parts of the country were driven into recession. In 2015 economic growth was below 1%, and in 2016 economic growth was only 1.3%. We were below potential. That meant that the slack in the economy was increasing and so there was scope for monetary and fiscal policy to provide support.

However, this year the Canadian economy is likely to have the fastest growth in the G7. Economic growth is likely to be over 3%. This is one of the reasons the Bank of Canada has now reversed the half point of rate cuts it provided in the fallout of the commodity shock. The Bank of Canada has scaled back the amount of monetary stimulus it's providing.

Looking forward, I would argue that the Canadian economy does not need fiscal stimulus at a time when the slack in the economy is being eaten up. Having said that, I do believe that we have an infrastructure deficit. I do believe a lot of our infrastructure was put in place in the 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s. It's old. It needs refurbishment. It needs replacement.

I think that public investment in infrastructure can be a catalyst to private sector investment. In point of fact, investing in core economic and social priorities has merit, but ultimately you have to be fiscally responsible, and that means returning to balance. I don't think the government should eliminate the deficit in one year—I think it would be too much of an economic adjustment—but ultimately, I think balancing the books is called for.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you, both.

Mr. Fergus.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to ask the Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne representatives some questions.

Ms. Bourgeois and Mr. Mocquais, in your recommendations, you emphasized the importance of investing more in the education of people who will work in health care.

I've spoken with a number of Canadians who are part of the linguistic minority. They all noted the extent to which the lack of services in their language has led to major issues when they fall ill. These people are often older. They can't find health care in their first language.

There's a lag between the training of health care professionals and service delivery. Can you talk about the importance of investing more in the education of people who can provide health care services to linguistic minorities, especially those made up of francophones outside Quebec?

[Pierre-Yves Mocquais]

Thank you for your question, Mr. Fergus.

First, these programs are absolutely essential. However, we must always make a distinction between the short programs, which are delivered quickly, and the longer programs, which can achieve more advanced objectives over time. We're working on these two levels.

Let's take the case of Alberta, where I'm from. There are growing needs in this field, and we're unable to meet them. In the past three years, the number of students applying for admission to the bilingual nursing program at the University of Alberta has more than doubled. However, there are a limited number of places. The demand for nursing attendant training, which is very short, is constantly increasing. The demand is extremely high, and we're currently unable to meet it.

These things absolutely must be implemented in the anglophone provinces in Canada.

I'll leave the floor to my colleagues if they want to respond as well.

[Lise Bourgeois]

I'll build on what Mr. Mocquais said and explain what we could do with increased funding.

First, it would help maintain the long or short training programs we already provide. Increased funding would help us work together to increase the number of programs, both in terms of the current health care services being provided and the new services to meet new needs.

I've heard a great deal of discussion here about the aging population and the fact that not all people receive care in hospitals. I'm part of the management team of a college, and I can say there's an increasing demand for home care and there are new health care needs.

Increased funding would enable us to provide more health care and legal training, and even to quickly adapt our programs to better accommodate new immigrants and meet their needs.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Thank you.

Ms. Brouillette, you do have anything to add?

[Lynn Brouillette, Acting Director General, Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne]

Yes, please.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

At this point, Greg, we're out of time.

Go ahead.

[Lynn Brouillette]

I simply want to add something about clients.

Mr. Alexander referred to immigrants and international students. These people represent many of the clients in our 21 francophone colleges and universities across Canada. There are also many clients from francophone and immersion schools. All these clients will become bilingual graduates who are able to provide services in both official languages.

That's why we're asking for a larger investment in the multi-year action plan for official languages, which will cover the next five years. In the past 10 years, this action plan has maintained the status quo in terms of funding. The funding we're discussing must come from this plan. Larger investments are needed for us to be able to train professionals who can give all Canadians not only services in French, but services in both official languages.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Mr. Chair, to clarify, it's just a yes-or-no answer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Okay.

Yes or no, quickly.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Ms. Brouillette, you said the status quo had been maintained in terms of funding. Are you referring to an indexed or nominal status quo?

[Lynn Brouillette]

I was referring to a non-indexed status quo.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Thank you.