Finance Committee on Oct. 25th, 2016

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

I would love if this actually happens because, having been in municipal government, I remember how frustrating and awful it was to try to push private developers to do anything for accessibility that wasn't at a cost to the consumer, and those with disabilities are already at a disadvantage for home ownership.

[Brad Brohman]

Yes.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

I truly hope this pilot goes forward, notwithstanding any funding obligations, but I think that the intent is great.

I had a question for both veterans associations. I don't know who can answer this. You talked about pensions. This was probably one of the clearest presentations I've heard on veterans' issues, so thank you for that first of all.

You mentioned pensions in comparison to the private sector, and the clawback for disability payments. It's something that bothers me too, when someone who has a disability tries to get employment and he or she is at a disadvantage.

Someone mentioned it in comparison to the public service. Is that the model you'd look to, or do you have an idea, or do you just want something fixed, and you consulted with veterans themselves to create that?

[Jim Scott]

Thank you. I'll take half of this and Sean will take the other half.

In the provincial workers compensation program in 2012 in, say, British Columbia, you insure a person's income up to $72,000 a year. That's $6,000 a month. If they're totally disabled, they will get $6,000 reduced to 75% of that, to $4,000. That is non-taxable and not subject to clawback. If they can go out, get a law degree, and work after that, the $4,000 is their base. Nothing ever happens to it.

Under the new Veterans Charter, they're given earnings loss benefits. The new Veterans Charter says that they can sue the claimant if the claimant becomes healthy again and doesn't declare it. The government now is toying with a pension of $1,400 a month for disabled soldiers, almost one-third of what the provinces give. The question is, why?

These are the issues that we deal with.

[Sean Bruyea]

When I look at developing a model and doing the research in my academic work, as well as my advocacy, I look first at what's available out there. When we say that military service is the highest form of public service, then it better be a higher form of compensation than the public service.

We have to also separate the two types of pensions. There are the pensions, which shouldn't be called pensions, but are really monthly gratuities paid for pain and suffering. That's the lifelong pension that the Liberal government has promised to return to. That recognizes that a disability is lifelong, the suffering is lifelong, and the payment should be lifelong too.

The other ones we're talking about are simply offsets to income replacement programs.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

You're out of time, Jen.

Go ahead, Mr. Deltell.

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to your House of Commons.

I would like to extend special greetings to Mr. Saillant, a gentleman from Quebec City I have known forever. We started our careers at the same time.

When I was a journalist, in 1989, Mr. Saillant, I clearly remember going to see you in the Saint-Roch neighbourhood.

My question will be for Chris Bloomer.

Mr. Bloomer, welcome to the House of Commons. Maybe you have recognized that I'm from Quebec, thanks to my accent. I can tell you that all of my colleagues from Quebec on the Conservative side are strong and very proud supporters of pipelines and the Energy East project. I can assure you of that.

We consider the fact, as you are considering, that as far as the environment, the economy, and safety are concerned, this is the best way to transport oil. Nothing can beat what you're doing as a pipeline builder. We also recognize that those of us in Quebec have had good experience. We have 2,000 kilometres of pipeline in Quebec. We constructed a very good pipeline network of 250 kilometres from Saint-Nicolas, on the south shore of Quebec City, to Montreal only five years ago. There has been 0% tragedy or malfunction. Everything is all right in Quebec.

People are afraid to see a pipeline under the St. Lawrence River. We are all concerned with environmental issues, but I can assure the House that in Quebec there are nine pipelines under the St. Lawrence River, and the one to be built by Energy East will be not three feet under the St. Lawrence River, but 300 feet. More than that, just between the pipeline and the St. Lawrence River there are 40 metres of hard rock—so yes, it's a safe way to transport oil.

As you can see, I'm a strong supporter of that. We are all, on our side, supporters of this project. I want to be sure everyone understands that.

You are not the ones who produce petroleum. You are the ones who transport it, and many other businesses are involved in this project. How will business be affected by the new Liberal carbon tax that will apply to every business that is involved in any production?

[Chris Bloomer]

You mean the carbon tax overall?

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Yes.

[Chris Bloomer]

Well, it's going to have an impact. It is another tax. I think everybody's going to pay for that. We haven't quantified at this point what that's going to be, because we're also working in Alberta with a CO2 tax and so on, but it's going to be a burden on everyone.

The fact of the matter is that if you collect $1 of tax, even if you're going to recycle it back to the provinces and so on, there's going to be a pretty significant percentage of that tax that gets caught up in administrating it. You're not going to get $1 back for the $1 in, so there's a drag right there that is not effective.

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

What about the new PPC that will be imposed by the government? The pension plan will cost business $1,000 per employee, and for each employee $1,000 more. The new PPC plan will cost $2,000 for every working person in Canada . How do you think it will affect your business?

[Chris Bloomer]

You're talking about the additional pension plan.

Well, again, it's an additional burden on individuals, and it takes away from disposable income, and that's an impact.

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

I just want to make a correction.

Mr. Chair, you're right; it's the Canada Pension Plan. In French it's the plan pension du Canada. I'm sorry for the mistake.

Thank you so much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you.

Mr. Phelps, you weren't asked any questions. Maybe it was because your brief was so perfect. I'm not sure. Do you want to add anything to close the panel?

[Fred Phelps]

I would encourage, in moving forward with the national affordable housing plan, that we look at accountability measures with the provinces and territories so we are actually investing in the right locations so that the social determinants of health are being addressed and the primary health care costs are being reduced.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Okay. With that, I thank all of the witnesses for their presentations and the committee members for a fairly long afternoon with our second panel of the day.

I remind members that we have the budget implementation act, Bill C-29, to be reviewed.

With that, thank you all.

This meeting is adjourned.