Fisheries Committee on Nov. 26th, 2007

[James Boland]

Hopefully we're not. I think Indian Affairs in the treaty process should recognize that these harbours are valuable assets to the first nations community, and they should be part of the process, rather than their understanding or their hope that DFO will continue to maintain and update them after the treaty process is settled.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

There are 15 harbours, you said, involved in the process right now. How different is it for one of these harbours...and this is primarily, exclusively, run by first nations groups?

[James Boland]

Some of them are run by first nations groups. Some of them are supported by the small craft harbours program. But when you get involved in a treaty process, it's our belief that they should be considered part of the whole asset that the natives are negotiating for or that the crown is negotiating with them for.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

So how different are these 15 harbours from another regular harbour, like Steveston, which is the biggest one, isn't it?

[James Boland]

They don't have any other way to support them. They're on the water, and there are no roads into them, so the harbour is an integral part of their community.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

I want to go back to aquaculture for just a moment, because you mentioned it's like a piece of the puzzle that doesn't have much of a historical record because it's a come-lately sort of thing, I would assume. I have in my area a lot of blue mussel farms, and they have problems trying to use the current infrastructure that is out there. So how much of the investment of the $38 million goes towards aquaculture when it comes to small craft harbours? In other words, how much do they have to change to take in some of these interests for aquaculture?

[Jackey Richard]

As I mentioned in my opening remarks, we cater to an expanded client base, including aboriginals entering the fishery as well as aquaculture business relying on our sites for service and access. We don't divvy up the budget based on the type of fishery. The way we allocate our funds is we have a priority rating system that considers every project submission independent of each other and it is weighted against criteria.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Does aquaculture then figure prominently in that weighted system?

[Jackey Richard]

Not as a weight, no. What happens is we have safety considerations, and obviously if you're dealing with overcrowded facilities and congestion, if aquaculture is part of that client mix, it does add to the pressures and the traffic at a facility.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Certainly you would give it emphasis and a weight because of that reason alone. In other words, if there's a massive influx of activity on any particular harbour because they recently started an aquaculture initiative, would they be in line to receive more funding or be a larger priority as a result of that?

[Jackey Richard]

We don't provide facilities that are exclusive to aquaculture interests, but obviously if you're dealing with a congested facility, then you're adding to the pressure there, and the pressures come from aquaculture business. Obviously it is adding to your safety rating in the priority rating system.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Speak to me about this priority rating system.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Thank you, Mr. Simms. I'm sorry.

Mr. Blais.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good afternoon.

Are there differences in the management of the Small Craft Harbour Program in the Maritimes and in the Gulf, for example? Do the differences in management stem from the geography of the area, the way things are done, or is it more fundamental? Do you operate on the same basis in terms of eligibility criteria: who gets money first, how the work is done, the speed with which they are done? Are there differences among the regions?

Ms. Richard.

[Jackey Richard]

Our office in Ottawa is making a big effort to try to develop a program that is consistent from one region to another. On the question of funds, our system is based on eight criteria and it applies in all regions. So it is a common system. On the question of the management of our harbour administration program, we take the same approach, to use leases. We establish our responsibilities with the harbour committees. That is also a common system. The harbour committees handle everyday questions and minor work.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

You said that your region covered three provinces: New Brunswick, Prince Edward Island and Nova Scotia. There are differences in those provinces or territories, if only geographical differences. One place may be more exposed to the wind and to strong tides. I am thinking about Nova Scotia, in particular, or southern New Brunswick. I imagine that this has an effect on infrastructures or structures.

How do you deal with the big differences between one area and another?

[Jackey Richard]

We do planning. We are in the process of preparing a long-term facilities plan with the harbour committees and communities. The climate that an area is facing has to be taken into consideration. Some places in the region have more need for dredging, for example. As well, the construction of wharves on the Bay of Fundy will be different from construction in other places in the Gulf region.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

How is the construction of wharves different in a place where there are stronger tides?

[Jackey Richard]

In the Bay of Fundy, there are more pile structures.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

More what?

[Jackey Richard]

Pile structures. I don't know the term in French.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Could you describe it?

We have 35-foot tides in the Bay of Fundy; therefore, the infrastructure is set up on piles.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

They are on pillars.

[Jackey Richard]

That's right. It is not constructed in the same way. I am not an engineer, I can't really describe how ...

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

So some differences are attributable to the different weather or geographical phenomena, and particularly to high tides.