Fisheries Committee on April 4th, 2017

[Jeff MacDonald]

The plans largely have to do with the development of marine protected area networks, so that we begin to understand not just why this particular area is interesting but also its relationship with the other areas in the same ecosystem.

When the network plans come out, then we'll be able to say we understand that all of these areas are ecologically linked. The next question would be about finding the right tool to protect them while at the same time minimizing the socio-economic impact. That's a public conversation and not one that's determined by just officials or just ministers. It's one that's done through the process we've described this morning.

[Pat Finnigan, Liberal, Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB]

We have 10 MPAs in Canada, so how many would you say are “no-take” or totally out of use commercially?

[Jeff MacDonald]

We have developed some information we could provide to the committee that describes not only the no-take areas in each of the MPAs but also what activities are permitted and not permitted. We could provide that to the clerk.

For the most part, all of our MPAs have an area that is a core protection zone. They also include an adaptive management zone on the outside. There are the examples I mentioned—the Gully, the Hecate Strait, Darnley Bay, etc. Those are ones for which we can provide that detail, but in our design, each one has a core protected zone.

[Pat Finnigan, Liberal, Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB]

I know Canada has a massive land mass, but some people would say that we're trailing behind other countries, such as the U.S. and the U.K. Is there a plan to catch up or are we kind of pressured to move in that direction to make more MPAs?

[Philippe Morel]

The Aichi targets set 10% for marine protected areas in country, and Canada subscribes to that. By 2020 we should meet the criteria, the international target. Some countries are more aggressive, but we believe we can meet the 2020 target and be comparable to other countries.

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

Thank you, Mr. Finnigan.

Mr. Donnelly, go ahead for three minutes, please.

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Maybe I'll start with Mr. Morel.

Could you describe MPAs as having a long-term economic benefit to fisheries?

[Philippe Morel]

Certainly they can. If you consider, for example, what they can provide as protection for habitat and reproduction of certain species that could be endangered or just have lower stocks, MPAs—because fish do swim and go outside of the MPAs— can provide other opportunities elsewhere where there's no protection needed, according to our analysis.

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

To date, the existing MPA collectively protects only 1% of Canada's oceans. I'm not sure if you've said this before in response to any of the questions being asked today by the committee members, but do you feel that the government's five-point plan will achieve 5% by the end of this year?

[Philippe Morel]

Yes, and it is challenging because it's fast; we're already in 2017. It is an exciting challenge that I think we will meet with all the measures we were able to put in place with our partners: parks, and environment, and also other stakeholder provinces and the fisheries closure. But I think we will meet the 5%.

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

How are OECMs being integrated into marine area network planning? That's the other effective area-based conservation measure.

[Philippe Morel]

How they're integrated in the target?

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Yes, to the overall plan, the network, the marine protected area plan.

[Philippe Morel]

The way we do it right now is that we develop the criteria. We have consulted on these criteria with science, with a council of academics—it was a CSAS process—and with other stakeholders, while we were defining those five criteria.

We are in the process of looking at all the existing fisheries closures to see if they meet the criteria and whether we have the proper information to count them as protected areas toward our target. There will be some of the areas—not all of them—that will meet the target, for sure.

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

So they will be included.

[Philippe Morel]

They'll be included.

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

Thank you, Mr. Donnelly.

Folks, that ends two rounds, much earlier than we anticipated.

What I'd like to do, if it's okay with everyone, is to have you put up your hand if you have an interest in asking a question.

Oh, my, this is how popular you've become today. You have been very gracious with your time.

Why don't we do five-minute rounds? If that is okay, we'll go with three parties, five minutes each. Then, if we have time at the end, we can apportion some time if you have to ask a question.

I'd also like to do something different. At the end, if any of our guests would like to add something you didn't get a chance to add—we have department officials only once to start this study—something you feel you missed, we'll give you that opportunity, since we have the time.

So, it's five, five, and five, and we'll go to Mr. McDonald first, for five minutes, please.

[Ken McDonald, Liberal, Avalon, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll share my time with Ms. Jordan.

I have one question. There might be a couple of questions in one, but my question is around enforcement.

We have marine protected areas now, or ocean protected areas. We're looking at increasing that.

How are we doing with regard to enforcement on activities that are not permitted in these areas, whether it be fishing or shipping or drilling or exploration, or anything else? Have we been doing a good job of enforcement? Do you see taking on an aggressive increase in the areas that are going to add to the problem of trying to provide the proper enforcement?

[Philippe Morel]

It's part of the mandate of the fisheries officers to also look at the protection offered under the Oceans Act. It's part of their duties.

However, the proper answer to your question is that every time we designate an MPA, we also have to put a management plan in place. It's in this management plan that the enforcement activities are included. They can be shared among fisheries officers or DFO staff, but they could also be shared with provincial authorities or indigenous guardians, or other monitoring organizations that can help reach the target. That's done in the management plan for each of the MPAs that are negotiated.

[Ken McDonald, Liberal, Avalon, NL]

Thank you.

[Bernadette Jordan, Liberal, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I have a question that is twofold. Recently Corsair Canyon, Georges Bank, and Jordan Basin were designated benthic areas, protected areas.

Is that the same process for an MPA in terms of the community consultation, which is my big concern, and who was asked the question about that? Second, is this the first step in moving to make that a total MPA?

[Philippe Morel]

Do you want to answer that?

[Jeff MacDonald]

Yes. I can start, and then we can move to Annette if she has more specific details on the process. But certainly, yes, the way we proceeded in identifying those areas was along the same lines as the one we use for establishing an MPA. Certainly it was through research that we did with the United States where we identified not only the importance of canyons but a lot of the coral and sponge concentrations that led to those particular designations.

The fishing industry itself also provided us with a lot of information. They know where higher concentrations are, so we used that information as well.

Specifically as to whether or not this is going to proceed to be a marine protected area, right now these are areas where we would consider other measures for the purpose of saying that the only human activity that's taking place in those areas is commercial fishing, and as we reach an agreement with the industry these would be closed areas; it's not necessarily going to go forward as a marine protected area. If we feel that the conservation objective is being met and that they can count toward our target, then we don't necessarily need to proceed to an MPA.

Annette, did you have any more detail on the consultation?

[Annette Daley]

In the case of Fisheries Act closures, our colleagues at resource management would usually meet directly with licence-holders who are impacted in a particular area, and they also have what we call species advisory committees. So they might have committees on haddock or snow crab and that type of thing. So they have those advisory committees, which they would also meet with quite regularly and brief on any changes that are coming for Fisheries Act closures or potential discussions of other types of conservation measures.

[Bernadette Jordan, Liberal, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Does that area fall into your 5%?