Evidence of meeting #28 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was prawns.
A video is available from Parliament.
President, United Fishermen and Allied Workers' Union – Unifor
Last year there might have been one hiccup just with COVID protocols about boarding vessels, but otherwise they have that right anytime.
Liberal
Bobby Morrissey Liberal Egmont, PE
So am I correct, then, that DFO protection and enforcement personnel can board a vessel and choose a sample randomly?
Executive Director, Pacific Prawn Fishermen’s Association
Yes. We encourage them to do so if they have questions.
Liberal
Bobby Morrissey Liberal Egmont, PE
I, like the rest of the members of this committee, am baffled as to what the objective is here. If the stock has been fished for over 50 years with this practice and is stable going forward, I can see where the fisher would want to do it, because here on the east coast, the scallop fishery will open tomorrow in my riding. I can buy product directly from the fisher, frozen scallop meat, and a lot of people do, and the fisher wants to do it for the same reason you're doing it, because they get a better price.
I am surprised at why enforcement came in here at the last moment.
I would have a question here—and tell me when I'm out of time: if it goes to the commercial processor, who controls the commercial processing industry? Is it one control on the B.C. coast?
Liberal
Bobby Morrissey Liberal Egmont, PE
Not on prawn, so is the processing sector widespread?
Again, I'm confused, as well, as why DFO would spring this on your industry at the last moment. DFO has a really good history of, “Blank, blank, blank fisherman off”, on an ongoing basis.
Lead Representative, Prawn Industry Caucus
I'll quickly point out that the PPFA hired Landmark to do studies of our management system in response to the management evaluation that DFO had requested. In that study, there is quite a bit of data modelling that indicates that we're not fishing as much of the harvestable biomass that is available to us.
Liberal
Bloc
Marilène Gill Bloc Manicouagan, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to finish the round of questioning that we had started earlier. I had asked the witnesses here what their expectations were in the short, medium and long term.
I believe Mr. Atkins has responded and Ms. Orr did not finish her response. So I would like to give her the opportunity to do so. If not, the other witnesses could speak as well.
Lead Representative, Prawn Industry Caucus
I believe it should be possible to reverse the new thinking, and revert back to what was the status quo before this issue evolved. Failing that, harvesters would be much more willing to thaw out tubs of prawns upon an inspection request than to be cancelled out of the opportunity to sell their product in tubs.
Everyone the PIC represents is very much hopeful that we can come to a resolution that would allow the continuance of freezing prawn tails in tubs. As for the manner in which we achieve that, we're certainly open to a conversation and very hopeful to have it resolved as quickly as possible.
Managing Director, BC COVID-19 Active Fishermen’s Committee
I would echo those comments. In the short term, the identification of a random sample as being sufficient to meet the needs.... Moving forward, some kind of standardization set with the industry on tub size and transparency, that kind of thing, would be useful. I just hope we do not outlaw this method of taking product to market in the long term.
President, United Fishermen and Allied Workers' Union – Unifor
Yes, I have no problem with anybody coming aboard and wanting to inspect my catch for quality control and compliance, but I don't want to give up tubbing, because it provides for the highest quality product.
If I have to sell an inferior product to locals, what's the point? You make a bad name for yourself, and you lose the market entirely.
Bloc
Marilène Gill Bloc Manicouagan, QC
As I understand it, you simply need a channel of communication with the department. I use the word “simply” even though this situation remains complex.
Liberal
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
My question is for Mr. Lawson.
It's my understanding that there are about 230 vessels fishing prawns and that you can only stack two licences, so you can only have about 500 traps. This sounds like it's a small-scale fishery with all independent operators.
Can you talk about the size of the fleet, how small it is and how important this fishery is to that fleet?
President, United Fishermen and Allied Workers' Union – Unifor
I think there are about 240 licences. I'm not sure how many operators there are, because I don't know how many do stack. Like you said, it's either 300 traps for a single licence, or 500 traps for a double licence. This fishery is very important to fisheries businesses.
As a younger harvester, last year it was at least a third to half of my income. Given the way fisheries are now, we have to be diverse. Taking the value out of a fishery like this really hurts my career as a fisherman as whole, not just in this fishery, because what I gain in value from prawns for my business pays for my upgrading into other fisheries, as well. It spills over, so that I am a more well-rounded career fisherman.
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
In Tofino, where I'm from, the Spot Prawn Festival is done with the Pacific Prawn Fishermen's Association and Chefs' Table Society of British Columbia. This isn't just about our economy; it's about our culture.
Ms. Orr, can you talk about the impacts of that on our culture and what's on peoples' plates at restaurants in B.C.?
Lead Representative, Prawn Industry Caucus
It's great to hear that you've been to a prawn festival before, which I've helped host before in False Creek as well. It's a terrific show of the community, and so many people enjoy celebrating what we have to offer from our fishery here .
When I think about the people there watching cooking demonstrations by local chefs and speaking with members of the fishing community about how prawns are caught and having that exposure to something that is literally on their doorstep, it's a connection that people have that is part of the fabric of our coastal communities.
So removing the accessibility of the public to purchasing seafood from the vessels is undermining the relationship between harvester and community. What other building blocks can be as important as that in preserving coastal communities?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
No, you're all up, sir; you're just a couple of seconds over.
We now go to Mr. Arnold for five minutes or less, please.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
This appears to be a real legal desktop interpretation of the regulations, without consideration of the practicality of the on-water situation.
Mr. McIsaac, you identified that DFO was not able to share their legal interpretation of the regulation. Can you tell me how harvesters can attempt to ensure that they are complying with the regulations if the department responsible for enforcing is unwilling to share their legal interpretation with the harvesters before they go out?
Managing Director, BC COVID-19 Active Fishermen’s Committee
It certainly makes it very difficult. DFO is very clear that the onus is on the harvester to comply with the regulation, but they don't seem willing to give us their interpretation of the regulation, which is very challenging. You can imagine that.
I've got to be clear here that they're speaking out of both sides of their mouths on this. They put out a fisheries notice on April 9, and I'll read one line from it:
Freezing of whole or tailed product in solid blocks or tubs of ice will require that the harvester provide randomly selected samples to be thawed for inspection by Fishery Officers.
That's exactly what we had asked them for through February and March—something that clearly says that this is the situation.
On the same day, they emailed us and said that conservation and protection will apply discretion in the enforcement of the approach in the 2021 season, recognizing the efforts that the industry has put in.
These two pieces conflict for harvesters. They're sending mixed messages to harvesters on exactly what the situation is for the season, and that's a huge challenge.