Evidence of meeting #30 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was need.
A video is available from Parliament.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
Jaime Battiste Liberal Sydney—Victoria, NS
Thank you for that.
My questions will be to the Nuu-chah-nulth witness. I come from Mi'kmaq territory, where we've seen it's best when plans are based on collaboration. There are several nations along the B.C. coast, as well as several stakeholders.
I'm wondering, with the money that our government is investing moving forward, what you feel is the best way that indigenous communities on the B.C. coast can be engaged and involved in the process of developing a plan moving forward.
4:50 p.m.
Fisheries Program Manager, Nuu-chah-nulth Tribal Council
Larry, do you want to start with that one?
4:50 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
Sure. The best way to be engaged is....
With my group at least, we're a treaty group, so we are already collaborating. I think that if you can focus on some of the varied marine areas, you could sort out some funding regarding business development for aquaculture and establishing partnerships with industry.
I'll leave it at that for now.
4:50 p.m.
Fisheries Program Manager, Nuu-chah-nulth Tribal Council
First nations need to be decision-makers at the table with DFO. It's that simple. We don't need to be consulted and we don't need to be engaged; we need to be decision-makers as a level of government, as right holders, in deciding how the money can best be put to work.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
Jaime Battiste Liberal Sydney—Victoria, NS
Mr. Johnson, you talked a little bit about fish farms being bad words, and we've heard some reluctance around hatcheries as well.
Can you talk to me a bit about how fisheries have evolved in B.C. in terms of the indigenous view on how to best bring back the salmon stocks?
4:50 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
I can give you my view on it. It's hard to speak for everyone else.
My view on bringing the salmon back involves looking at production, upping the production, looking at survival rates, looking at pinniped management and predator control, and looking at collaboration among governments and first nation groups.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
Jaime Battiste Liberal Sydney—Victoria, NS
Okay.
Mr. Johnson, can you tell me—I know when I ask for an indigenous perspective from B.C., it's difficult—whether there's any discussion happening with the British Columbia AFN level about some of the solutions moving forward? Do you think that's a good forum to use for this discussion, or is there a better forum that looks specifically at the indigenous communities that live along the coast?
4:50 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
I think the AFN could be appropriate to look at indigenous things on the coast, but I think speaking directly with the nations, with the tribal groupings, is likely the best, and even drilling down right to the specific nation levels. I think we get caught up in this cookie-cutter approach a lot of times. Each individual nation has their story.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
Jaime Battiste Liberal Sydney—Victoria, NS
How many nations on the B.C. coast do you think would be part of this discussion? In the Atlantic we have three nations. In B.C., what is the number?
4:55 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
I think there's something like over 208 or 209 nations in B.C. Of those, I think probably a quarter, so 45 to 50, would be my best guess in terms of marine involvement.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
4:55 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
I would say it's a mixture. It just depends on what you like to be called, I guess. I know that with our modern-day treaty, we like to be called nations.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Jaime Battiste Liberal Sydney—Victoria, NS
When I talk about nations, I mean the language they speak. Are you saying there are still over 200 nations in B.C.?
4:55 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
That's individual nations. The language groupings are much different. I'm part of the Nuu-chah-nulth, which is 14 groups and one language.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you for that, Mr. Battiste.
We'll now go to Mr. Mazier for five minutes or less, please.
May 10th, 2021 / 4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you to the witnesses for coming out this afternoon.
Mr. Johnson, you mentioned the economic opportunities associated with aquaculture and its positive impact on local economies. Can you expand on how aquaculture creates opportunities for first nations and rural communities?
4:55 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
First nations people, particularly the Nuu-chah-nulth, are ocean-going people. Nuu-chah-nulth literally means “people of the mountains facing the sea”. We are definitely a part of anything to do with the ocean. It goes back to our principles of hishuk'ish tsawalk, the interconnectedness. We are connected to our environment, connected to our lands, connected to our resources.
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
How should the federal government support communities who rely on aquaculture?
4:55 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
I think we need to have capital funding for business development. We need to have business development to establish partnerships with industry. We need the funding for that. We need the province to support and build to be able to process the applications. We need governments to honour UNDRIP and give first nations decision-making ability to make the decisions on what types of aquaculture they want to develop in their territories, and provide the funding necessary so the first nations can make it happen.
First nations can provide advice on examples of how to breathe life into UNDRIP that's meaningful for that first nation. If you let first nations help the government define UNDRIP through economic development, I think there are some really good opportunities there. There are some good partnerships out there. As a matter of fact, I think networking on some of the positives would be beneficial for some of the first nations of British Columbia.
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Mr. Johnson, you also raised concerns in your opening remarks about the lack of predator management and the discussions around that. Can you explain the impact that the lack of predator management discussions are having on the Pacific salmon stocks? Why are these conversations not being held, do you believe?
4:55 p.m.
President, Nuu-chah-nulth Seafood Limited Partnership
Well, the environmental groups.... I like to call them “environmental activists”, because everyone is afraid to deal with this.
The first nations role in our environment prior to contact was to maintain the balance of nature. It's unbalanced right now. Seals and sea lions are going up into rivers and eating salmon. That never would have happened in the old days. I think what needs to happen here is that we need to put things back into balance and into perspective.
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Okay. That's a good answer.
Dr. Beamish, you mentioned the importance of working together as an international team. What are the most important factors in creating a credible and effective international team?
4:55 p.m.
Research Scientist (Retired), As an Individual
That's a good question. I'm not sure I can answer it, but if I were doing it, we have a pretty good idea of the scientists who could contribute. When we had our expedition in 2019, I chartered, along with a colleague, the Professor Kaganovskiy, a Russian research ship. We loaded that ship with 21 scientists from the salmon-producing countries, and those guys worked effectively together even though the operating language was Russian on the ship.
We do have individuals who have a history of working together. You obviously must have a smaller committee, but we essentially know how to do it, and if we had the overall support from all countries, I'm confident we could have an effective committee. All we need is four or five governments to say “Let's do it.”