Fisheries Committee on March 24th, 2022

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

Yes.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Now, to the Avon River, summer dust storms have been wreaking havoc in the town of Windsor. You sign the order every two weeks to allow that river to stay dry. Once spring is over the riverbed dries up and it's sand. We have these terrible sandstorms in the town of Windsor.

The Liberal member of Parliament for Kings-Hants has written to you many times and has been very public, asking for you to alter that order so that at least in the summer some water is kept in that pond so that we don't get these environmentally hazardous and health-hazard sandstorms in the town of Windsor. Personally I'd like you to alter the order to return the pond.

Will you commit to look at altering that order when the time comes?

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

What I will commit to is what we are doing, which is working with the town, and working with the province that is responsible for the highway that is part of this challenge, and working with local community members who have been using the recreational facilities in the past in that area to find, with them, a way forward that also respects and protects the habitat that is important in that area for our fisheries.

We're very constructively engaged with all the partners on this, and I'm confident that we'll find a way forward that's mutually acceptable to all.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

So the dust storms will continue.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Perkins. We've gone a little bit over time.

We'll now go to Mr. Morrissey, who I understand may be sharing his time. I'll leave it up to him to decide when it is.

I will remind committee members to direct your comments through the chair when somebody says “you”. That would be me, and I have no intent of responding. I hear the Speaker in the House say that many times. I've been waiting a long while to say it.

We go on to you, Mr. Morrissey, for six minutes or less.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm sharing my time with Mr. Cormier.

Welcome, Minister. I have to pass on a compliment that was given to you in an earlier committee meeting when we were studying issues on the west coast. One of the witnesses said you are “the lone voice” in defending salmon”, Madam Minister.

My question is on small craft harbours. You identified in the supplementaries the additional money. Our government has committed significant additional dollars in the capital budget for small craft harbours, which are so important, as you identified, to our coastal rural communities. Could you give us some information on how fast your department is able to transfer it from a budget decision to actual piles being driven at these harbours across Atlantic Canada, or any place else?

Could you just give us a brief overview on the timeline it takes to get it from budget to actual projects, and then that work actually happening for the benefit of fishers?

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

Thank you.

Mr. Chair, this earpiece is cutting in and out. I don't know whether the technical staff can do anything about that, but in terms of amplification, it's not working very well.

Yes, I can talk about that, and then I will turn it over to the deputy for the more precise timing. For those who are interested in small craft harbours, which are many people across Canada—this is almost 1,000 small craft harbours—there was a lack of funding for 10 years into this program, and so there was a lot of backed-up maintenance that was needed when we were elected.

Since 2016, we've announced $784 million to invest in the small craft harbours program, and in this recent 2021 budget, there is $300 million. As I mentioned, there is a significant amount in the supplementary estimates.

What it takes to get from a budget to actually getting shovels in the ground are a set of steps. We want to do this on a needs basis, and there are almost a thousand of them. The first step is that staff in the regional offices collect information to evaluate the variety of proposed projects to do upgrades or replacements. They have a uniform set of criteria across all the regions.

The second step is that they make their evaluations on the safety and security as well as level of activity and value of catch. They feed that information in, and then the department conducts a national peer review of all the proposals across the country to determine which ones should be prioritized in a master five-year plan. Unfortunately, this does not mean there are going to be weeks between the funding and the action, and I know that people are very keen to get the job done.

Lastly, the department works with indigenous groups and community leaders in the planning and design of the specific project. At that point, the dollars can flow.

Perhaps the deputy minister can give a bit more—

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Actually, Minister, that's fine. If your official can provide the details—

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

Yes, we can do that in writing.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

—because I want to turn my time to my colleague, Mr. Cormier. If we could get the details submitted to the committee, that would be great.

Thank you, Minister.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

I thank my colleague Mr. Morrissey.

Minister, I don't have much time left, but I would like to thank you for coming to my riding last week. We had an opportunity to make a very nice announcement at the McGraw Seafood factory along with Jake Augustine. We also met with people from two associations, the Fédération régionale acadienne des pêcheurs professionnels and the Association des crabiers acadiens.

Crab, lobster and shrimp are part of a fishing industry that is very important in my region. Right whales have been present in the Gulf of St. Lawrence in the past five years, as you know. That is especially the case in my riding. That impacts fisheries. In recent years, we have put in place all the resources required for the season to begin as soon as possible, by conducting icebreaking operations, for example.

Could you tell us what you are doing this year to enable us to begin the season as soon as possible, minimize interactions with right whales and have a profitable fishing season across our industry?

Thank you, Minister.

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

Thank you for the question, Mr. Cormier. I also thank you for giving me the opportunity, last week, to visit people and fishing grounds on the Acadian peninsula.

As you mentioned, I had conversations with fish harvesters and the Acadian Crabbers Association. I saw how important the crab fishery is to your community and the critical role DFO plays by getting access to the fishery as early as possible in the season.

Thank you for showing me those maps of the ice and how it slowly melts. There are choke points, and so that's the essence of what we're working on. We know that crabbers have to get out into the water as early as possible. There are some areas in the inner harbour where we have small icebreakers heading up to your area—the Coast Guard icebreakers—as we speak. With regard to the amphibious machines that need to go into those tighter channels to move that ice, those contracts are being signed and those will be there soon. Then there will heavier icebreakers and Canadian Coast Guard hovercrafts.

We're putting in all of our equipment and our forces to help your constituents and fishers get out on the water as soon as possible.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Thank you, Minister, and thanks again for your visit last week.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Cormier.

We'll now go to Madame Desbiens for six minutes or less, please.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I also want to thank the minister for joining us. She is being very generous with her time, and we really appreciate that.

An amount of $148 million was added in this new class of millions, if I may put it that way. In Quebec, we are a bit worried about our small ports that are not necessarily used commercially, but that are used for entertainment and recreational activities at sea.

For example, I am thinking of the port in Verchères, a municipality that is turning 350 years old this year. The federal government owns that port, but it is inaccessible. Barriers have been installed. Verchères is 350 years old, which is older than Canada. People are worried about ending up with a completely obsolete wharf in the middle of beautiful grounds they will have set up for the festivities.

What portion of that $148 million will be used for small ports like this one, which urgently need repairs and which the municipality is ready to take over again once they have been upgraded? We have a few of those, including on the Îles de la Madeleine and the Île d'Orléans, as well as in a number of coastal villages.

Could you comment on that?

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

As I mentioned, the process of making a decision amongst a thousand harbours, especially when there was a big backlog of work facing us in 2016, is a careful one. It's not as fast as people would like, but we are absolutely committed to repairing and transitioning some of these harbours.

Where there is not a core commercial purpose—and that commercial purpose can be things other than fisheries, such as tourism and so on—and there is a community that is interested, we divest the docks, the wharves, to the community. That is a very positive program. I have visited small harbours where the community and the harbour management group have a whole set of community members who are involved with the work they're doing. It is a really strong community-building process. It sounds like a natural for your situation, but I'll turn it over to the deputy to see if there are any specifics we can share.

[Timothy Sargent, Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans]

Thank you for the question.

The Verchères federal wharf is actually a priority for us. We are very aware of the problems you talked about.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

It is indeed an emergency. I am happy to hear you say so. It gives us some hope. People in Verchères will also be happy, as well as my colleague Mr. Xavier Barsalou‑Duval.

On another topic, I would like to talk to you about the Canadian Coast Guard.

In Quebec, it has been brought up that certain emergency services were still not being offered effectively in French. A few facts have been reported on.

Budgets and equipment were also discussed. Although we are not talking about accidents like those we have seen on the Pacific side, people have still lost their lives because the Canadian Coast Guard was not equipped to save them. For example, I am thinking of the people who were paddleboarding in the Baie des Rochers.

Is there a budget set aside for the Canadian Coast Guard's equipment on the St. Lawrence River?

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

Thank you for that question.

I would first like to say that we are committed to providing services in both official languages everywhere, to the best of our ability.

As for the specific question concerning equipment, I will ask the commissioner to answer it.

[Mario Pelletier, Commissioner, Canadian Coast Guard, Department of Fisheries and Oceans]

Thank you for the question.

Budgets enable us to ensure that equipment is always cutting–edge. We have an equipment review program in place and we ensure that all search and rescue stations have the same type of equipment from coast to coast to coast. No specific sector is prioritized. Equipment is reviewed regularly and replaced as needed.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

I know that my colleague Mr. Cormier is also especially interested in the matter of services in French. Given the labour shortage, can we hope for special attention to be given to regions with the highest density of francophones in Canada?

[Mario Pelletier]

The reason there is a search and rescue coordination centre in Quebec is to have that francophone capacity. There are also francophone or bilingual search and rescue coordinators in Trenton and Halifax, which cover some of the Quebec sector's extremities.

If you have a specific case in mind, it would be my pleasure to follow up on it. That said, no cases have been brought to my attention.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Madame Desbiens.

We'll now go to Ms. Barron for six minutes or less, please.

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Minister, it's so nice to see you back today with us at committee. It was also nice to see you in my riding of Nanaimo—Ladysmith recently. I do hope that we can coordinate future visits. I have many people I'd love to introduce you to.

I did ask about this a bit. I was hoping to get some updates and for you to perhaps expand a little on your answer. We we know that in our B.C. waters here on the west coast we're seeing a rapid decline in Pacific wild salmon. We know that in order to protect these wild salmon, we need to get open-net pen fish farms out of our waters. Although we've been seeing steps in the right direction, we're still seeing proposals for massive increases in fish farming in regions like Clayoquot Sound. With many of the fish farming licences up for renewal in the next few weeks, we need a clear plan about how this government will meet its commitment by 2025.

I'm wondering if you can clarify when we will see a clear plan to transition away from open-net fish farms. Will this plan include moving away from in-water salmon farming in British Columbia?

[Joyce Murray, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

The protection of wild salmon is a total priority for British Columbians and, as we know, any manageable risk needs to be managed, so that's one of the reasons for the transition away from open-net pen salmon farming in coastal British Columbia waters. I would say that the transition has actually begun already with the December 2020 decision not to renew licences in the Discovery Islands area and to have those net-pens removed by summer of 2022.

Yes, we have a critical path for how we will move forward with this program. We're in consultation with the licence-holders, the indigenous communities and others on this so that we move forward in a holistic and skilful way. The decision on the current licences that you mentioned will be occurring over the coming months, so there are no decisions to be made immediately, and those consultations are important to that.

I am committed to a vision that this transition must include economic opportunities for communities to have the jobs and activities they need, so that's really why we need a responsible plan. I think that attracting the capital to create a world-class sustainable technology aquaculture industry is the opportunity here. What are the technologies that don't provide any or absolutely minimal interface or risk? Let's be the destination of choice for some of the sustainable aquaculture that's starting to emerge in other parts of the world today.