Fisheries Committee on Nov. 18th, 2025

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Thank you.

I would like an answer because it could, if it ever passed, have implications on the fishery.

Have any of you been consulted?

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

I have reached out to a number of members within the federation. They have only recently learned of the bill.

There is concern about it. At the present time, there's been—to my knowledge and from what I've heard—no consultation, but we are seeking it.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Okay.

Do Mr. Sproul or Mr. Mallet want to answer?

Mr. Mallet, go ahead on the private member's bill, which is before the House.

[Martin Mallet]

I would give an answer similar to Ms. Sonnenberg's.

I think that bill in particular would have significant impacts on how we manage other resources as well. I think it might be an issue about consulting and getting some more work done around it.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

You haven't been consulted yet?

[Martin Mallet]

Not the organization, no.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Okay.

Mr. Chapman, please go ahead.

[Bruce Chapman]

I also represent people in the Atlantic halibut fishery. To my knowledge, none of them have been consulted at this point.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Okay, thank you.

How is my time?

[The Chair, Liberal, Patrick Weiler]

Your time has lapsed.

Thank you very much, Mr. Morrissey.

Mr. Deschênes, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to come back to what you said, Mr. Mallet and Mr. Sproul, as I think it's important. You talked about political pressure.

First, Mr. Mallet, you said that the decision not to intervene in the matter of illegal fishing was entirely political in nature.

Could you explain to us what you're basing that on?

[Martin Mallet]

I've been in the fisheries sector for about 20 years, first as a biologist and then as a director at the Maritime Fishermen's Union for the last seven or eight years.

Over the past few years, I have had to make representations on many occasions to officials in the regions, as well as at the national level, at 200 Kent Street, in Ottawa. I've presented the same issues to six or seven ministers, and we always get the same responses.

The problem is not being resolved. As I mentioned earlier, we are told that the right to food fishing is a fundamental right and that it stems from the Constitution of Canada.

That said, the agreements are renewed every year in the form of a contract or treaty. It's there in black and white. The product of those fisheries must not be sold.

All we're asking for is equal application of the law to all of our fisheries, including first nations fisheries.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Mallet.

Mr. Sproul, you talked about a conspiracy.

What do you mean? Why do you say that?

[Colin Sproul]

Some people would believe this is a frontline issue or that there's animosity at the front line between DFO, C&P officers and our harvesters, but that couldn't be further from the truth. We share the communities and we're equally frustrated. I'm hesitant to speak for them, but we know them and we're in a position of trust with them. They tell us they are prevented from doing their job by their superiors because of political considerations.

This isn't an accusation on our part. It is widely understood in our communities that we view the law being broken day after day. We see fishery officers observe it taking place, yet nothing happens.

That's the bottom end of it, but the top end of it is certainly that the former national director of enforcement, Heather McCready, was influencing fishery officers and their command structure to not enforce the law against indigenous people who were violating the Fisheries Act. That's our accusation, and we firmly believe it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Patrick Weiler]

Thank you very much, Mr. Deschênes.

Before we wrap this first panel, I do want to give two minutes each to the Conservatives and then the Liberals to ask questions, and then we're going to wrap this panel and go on to the next one.

Mr. Gunn, go ahead.

[Aaron Gunn, Conservative, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Sproul, I want to follow up on that point you were just making. Can you summarize, in your view and from your experience, how commonplace the illegal fishing, illegal selling and illegal trafficking of fish by certain groups is? Also, do you believe DFO knows 100% who is responsible and that there is a conscious decision being made not to enforce the law in certain circumstances?

[Colin Sproul]

Over the last 10 years—every day, 24 hours a day, year round—there is illegal fishing taking place somewhere in the Maritimes. There's been a lot of focus on places like St. Marys Bay or St. Peters Bay, but the truth is that when Minister Jordan told people in Canada that it was okay for them to break the law, it was reasonable for them to assume they could, so it exploded. It planted the seed for it, and since that time we've seen it spread all across the maritime provinces.

What we need to focus on is a resolution to it. The only way that's going to happen is by enforcing existing law. If people don't like that, then the law needs to be changed, but in the absence of any law, we have chaos, and that's what's evident in our communities right now.

[Aaron Gunn, Conservative, North Island—Powell River, BC]

You mentioned that sometimes this is happening with certain indigenous groups. Do you think it ultimately hurts reconciliation and is unfair, maybe most of all, to those first nations who actually play by the rules and follow the rules?

[Colin Sproul]

I started fishing full time with my father in 1997, and the Marshall decision came down in 1999, so I've been party to this throughout my entire career. Initially there was a little bit of consternation, but over 20 years of carrying the same lunch down the same wharf and dragging your butt back up at the end of the day, that bred a lot of mutual respect, a lot of détente and a lot of water under the bridge. So much of that has been lost with the government's direction over the last decade in reconciliation. It's really terrible what has happened in our communities at a personal level.

However, let me be clear, the biggest victims of the government's direction on reconciliation in the fishery are rights-based harvesters. They hold the largest position in St. Marys Bay, so their catches in the communal commercial fishery are being hurt.

I think, most importantly, as I'll point out again, there's a new generation of animosity that's been created between indigenous and non-indigenous fishermen. To me, that's the ultimate bitter harvest of what's happened.

[The Chair, Liberal, Patrick Weiler]

Thank you very much, Mr. Gunn.

Lastly, we're going to go to Mr. Klassen for two minutes.

[Ernie Klassen, Liberal, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Thank you very much, Chair.

Thanks to the witnesses.

My question is for Melanie Sonnenberg.

You were talking about the owner-operators and the west coast and east coast not being in the act sufficiently. You mentioned that both the west coast and the east coast should have something in the act. Could you expand on what you see as the differences and where it should be placed in the act?

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

In the current way it's written it doesn't exclude B.C., but we do know, as we've spoken with you about, that they are excluded from it in the way that we enjoy—I say "enjoy", but that's not really the right word. The owner-operator applies in the east quite differently from the B.C. Pacific region.

What we're suggesting is—and there is already a plan afoot—a modernization of the fishery out there to encompass owner-operators, but it needs to move more quickly. The Fisheries Act needs to reflect very clearly that this includes B.C. It always was intended to include B.C. Even back when this concept was first introduced to the government, B.C. was part of that, and then there was an erosion of that policy on the west coast, which did not happen on the east coast. We see real corporatization of the fishery out there in a very substantial way, and that's why we include in our recommendations that we need to have it move faster before there's nothing left out there.

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

I'm sorry, but I missed the last part.

[Ernie Klassen, Liberal, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Do you see any place, in the fishing industry, for the commercialization of fishing?

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

I think that's for the B.C. people to work out. I can respond to that in writing if you like.