Foreign Affairs Committee on Dec. 5th, 2013

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I will try to bundle my questions together so that Mr. Komarnicki gets his time.

The first thing I would like to do, though, is to publicly thank our humanitarian aid workers who are doing an enormous job on the ground. You've all spoken about the dangerous situations in which they find themselves. As Canadians, we thank them for the work they're doing. They are people who are real heroes.

Mr. Salewicz, you and I spoke earlier about the situation with the children. The one thing we didn't get to was the problem of polio. We know there has been an outbreak in Syria. I wonder if you could speak a little bit about that.

Last January, there was a funding conference in Addis Ababa which our minister attended. Canada made its pledge. We made our contribution, but we know that other countries have not come to the table. We believe that people need to pay what they pledge. If I understand correctly, about 27% of the money that was pledged is what the international organizations have to work with. This means essentially only one in four refugees is being funded. Can you speak to that and tell us where that is? What do we expect at this conference in January?

[Stephen Salewicz]

Thank you for the questions.

First, let me agree with you and recognize the toll on humanitarian workers. The numbers are pretty stark: 12 UN staff have been killed; 32 Syrian Arab Red Crescent staff volunteers have been killed; 12 UN staff have been abducted; 9 staff have gone missing. In addition, 68 public health workers have been killed; 104 have been injured; and 21 have been kidnapped. The scope of the crisis is huge.

The first case of polio was identified on October 29, 2013. It's the first case since 1999. Unfortunately, there are 78 cases confirmed now. The UN, through WHO, UNICEF, and other partners, has launched an aggressive campaign to respond targeting 22 million children in the region through a vaccination program. We provide significant support to UNICEF and WHO, and that is having an impact. To date, they estimate that 19 million children have received vaccinations.

They have taken an approach that initially targets Syria first and then expands to neighbouring countries. They have given vaccinations to 2.2 million children. As with the humanitarian assistance, access remains the challenge. They are working with organizations on the ground to get that access.

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

I know I'm taking your time, but we need to thank Rotary International, because they've been very engaged.

[Stephen Salewicz]

Yes, indeed.

On your question of support to the international appeals, I think we are in better shape than we were previously. We have close to 61% of the appeals funded, $2.7 billion. That is still far from the $4.5 billion that's required. A lot was put on the table in Kuwait. Canada came with a strong contribution that we subsequently ratcheted up as the needs became apparent. It's hard to track some of the donations. We have a reporting system through the UN that is self-reported. A lot of the aid that goes in is bilateralized, and we don't have a good picture of that.

We continue to urge all contributors to the humanitarian response to report it through the UN so we can get a better picture of what's going on and things can be coordinated. I think we should applaud Kuwait for hosting the conference last year. They put in $300 million, pledged it, and disbursed it through the UN and the Red Cross.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Mr. Komarnicki.

[Ed Komarnicki, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

I've been listening and I've heard you describe the situation on the ground leading up to the Geneva II conference as very grim. I think somebody described it as beset with challenges, and somebody else said it was a dire conundrum, which to me would indicate that it is difficult to resolve.

Do you see any positive aspects which would lead you to believe that at this conference something might be achieved, notwithstanding how you've described the situation on the ground?

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Please answer very quickly, if you could.

[Mark Gwozdecky]

I'd say three things give one hope. One is that there's been diplomatic progress of late in the Middle East. The Iran nuclear agreement and the agreement to destroy Syria's chemical weapons shows that these parties can get to a deal under certain circumstances.

Finally, I can say, as someone who served in Syria many years ago, that Syrian people are fantastic people. It's a very secular society, and I don't believe they want what they currently have. I think they really want to get to a different state, and that would be a stable, democratic, pluralistic society.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Dewar, sir, you have five minutes.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Just a quick follow-up on the OPCW. I'm hearing that maybe the government is contemplating providing more funding for the program. Is that correct?

[Sabine Nolke]

We are considering options at this point.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I think we'd probably get a consensus here that it would be a good thing. We'll wait for us to write some recommendations on that, but I'm glad to hear it.

The follow-up to that, though, is there are some who put out the idea that somehow the opposition was using chemical weapons. With the evidence that's available, I think most people would be certain it was the government, but whatever. Put that aside for a second.

Would Canada be supportive of an ICC follow-up on this? It's clear that it needs to be the next step. Notwithstanding that Syria is not, I believe, a signatory to the Rome Statute, if the Security Council does support the investigators' going in, that could happen. Is that something we'd support?

[Sabine Nolke]

I'll be responding to this using my old hat as the lawyer responsible for the ICC and related institutions.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Sure. I'm glad you're here.

[Sabine Nolke]

Minister Baird has made it very clear that accountability for the crimes committed in Syria against the civilian population need to be accounted for and that the perpetrators need to be brought to justice.

Now, how that works in practice.... You said very correctly that Syria is not a party to the Rome Statute. However, the situation is contemplated in the Rome Statute. The Security Council would have the power to refer the situation in Syria, as they did with the situation in Libya, to the ICC and to the prosecutor for consideration, so that is an option. Whether or not that will happen is obviously a matter for the Security Council to determine.

The other alternative, of course, is that individual countries such as Canada have on their books legislation that permits prosecution for war crimes committed extraterritorially. Should Mr. Assad find himself in Britain or in Canada, for example, a jurisdiction could be taken by individual states, so that is a possibility. It's probably not a likely possibility, but it is out there.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I'm sure that, as a member state, we would want to support that application to the Security Council.

Coming up to the conference in Geneva, it's important to note that many have said what's on the agenda for Geneva II is what was on the agenda for Geneva I, which is to start to look at what some people call transitional government, but there needs to be confidence building to understand what that looks like.

I just want to understand this from the department's thinking. I've read the crisis group report, which is very good by the way, and they're recommending the release of some prisoners and access for humanitarian assistance. What are some of the other confidence-building initiatives that you would think would be important to see goodwill from certainly the opposition side to attend the conference?

[Mark Gwozdecky]

I think both sides can build confidence through various measures, including outside players stopping providing military support to one side or the other. That would be very, very important. A ceasefire would be a very big confidence-building measure. My statement also alluded to the strong possibility that we might see the opposite in the run-up to Geneva II. We might see an increase in violence on the ground as the sides try to increase their leverage.

We're talking in the realm here of maybe an ideal world, but certainly a ceasefire and a reduction or cessation of external support would be important and an opening up of the corridors. Full access to humanitarian organizations to deliver their assistance would be a third one. In that case both sides have something they can do to make that happen.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I don't have time, but could you get back to us on the numbers of refugees? Have there been interdepartmental meetings with CIC around refugees? If so, how many times have you met? I'm just curious about that coordination piece.

[Mark Gwozdecky]

We meet regularly, but I can't say we've had a specific meeting around whether or not to have a resettlement program. That's something where they've already established clear direction. That hasn't been something we've chosen to meet on, because we haven't been directed to do so.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you.

To our witnesses, thank you very much for taking the time to be here today.

We're going to suspend for a minute to go in camera so we can look at our OAS report.

[Proceedings continue in camera]