Foreign Affairs Committee on May 31st, 2018

[The Chair (Hon. Robert Nault (Kenora, Lib.)), Liberal, Bob Nault]

Colleagues, can we bring this meeting to order, please?

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), in the study of situations in Somalia, South Sudan, and the Democratic Republic of Congo, we're going to start off with witnesses from the Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development. Before us is Marc-André Fredette, Director General, Southern and Eastern Africa Bureau; Susan Greene, Director, South Sudan Development Division; Jean-Bernard Parenteau, Director, West and Central Africa Division; and last but not least, Nicolas Simard, Ambassador, Embassy of Canada to the Democratic Republic of Congo.

Welcome to all of you.

I'm not sure who is starting, but I think it's Mr. Fredette. We'll turn the floor over for opening comments and then, as is the normal practice, colleagues, we'll go into questions.

Mr. Fredette, please, the floor is yours.

[Marc-André Fredette, Director General, Southern and Eastern Africa Bureau, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development]

Thank you.

Mr. Chair and members of the committee, thank you for inviting us to speak here today. I'm pleased to provide an update on the situation in South Sudan, the Democratic Republic of Congo, and Somalia. I am accompanied by my colleagues you've just introduced: Susan Greene, Director for the South Sudan Development Division; our Canadian ambassador for the Democratic Republic of Congo, Nicolas Simard; and Mr. Jean-Bernard Parenteau, Director for the West and Central Africa Relations Division.

I would like, first, to outline the broader context and some key developments in sub-Saharan Africa. According to the World Bank, Africa will have six of the world's 10 fastest growing economies in 2018. A number of countries have made significant progress in areas such as health, education, and poverty reduction. Sub-Saharan Africa also has the world's youngest population. With the right policies, the International Monetary Fund estimates that the continent could realize a demographic dividend that increases per capita GDP by up to 50% by 2050. In short, there is immense potential.

Stability and security are needed in order to fully tap into this immense potential. In the case of South Sudan, the Democratic Republic of Congo, and Somalia, ongoing challenges include protracted conflicts resulting in humanitarian needs, high levels of gender inequality, governance shortcomings, human rights violations, corruption, the impacts of climate change, forced displacement, and food insecurity.

South Sudan is the most fragile and among the poorest countries in the world. In 2013, only two years after the country's independence from Sudan, the country broke out into civil war. More recently, in December 2017, South Sudan's parties to the conflict signed a ceasefire as part of a revitalization process of a stalled peace agreement. However, violations of the ceasefire have been and continue to be far too frequent.

As a result of the protracted conflict, South Sudan is now the second largest source of displacement in Africa, after the Democratic Republic of Congo. More than 4.3 million people have been forced from their homes, representing a third of the country's population, with more than half taking refuge in neighbouring countries. More than seven million people remain severely food insecure. Despite the extraordinary humanitarian response when pockets of famine were identified in 2017, similar or worse conditions are expected in 2018.

Widespread human rights violations and abuses have been committed with impunity by all sides. Women and girls continue to bear the brunt of the conflict reflected in the extreme levels of sexual and gender-based violence and the systematic use of rape as a weapon of war.

The overall situation in the Democratic Republic of Congo is unfortunately similar. The eastern part of the country (Nord-Kivu and Sud-Kivu) has been grappling with an ongoing cycle of violence for more than 20 years. Three other regions are now also affected. As with South Sudan, the situation is having a significant impact on women and girls, who are especially vulnerable.

The humanitarian crisis in the DRC continues to be one of the longest-running and most complex in the world, with more than 13 million people requiring humanitarian assistance in 2018. The DRC recently surpassed South Sudan and became the country with the most displaced persons in Africa with approximately 4.4 million internally displaced persons and more than 700,000 refugees and asylum-seekers in neighbouring countries.

The country is also experiencing a political crisis. The main causes are the postponement of the general elections, mistrust of President Joseph Kabila—who might try to hold onto power—and a disastrous economic situation. Despite some positive developments, such as the announcement that elections are to be held in December 2018, tensions remain very high.

The main opposition parties, civil society groups and most of the population have lost confidence in the country's institutions. In particular, they are demanding that democratic space be expanded, through respect for human rights, including freedom of expression, association and peaceful assembly. Moreover, the country's security forces are responsible for more than half of the human rights violations.

Somalia is at a critical phase in state-building. After decades of civil war and instability, the country, ranked the world's second most fragile state—I forgot to rank the Congo; it's sixth—concluded parliamentary and presidential elections in December 2016 and February 2017, respectively. The Government of Somalia is focused on addressing myriad challenges. These include widespread corruption, delivering essential services to citizens, long-standing regional grievances and clan dynamics, and the persistent threat from al Shabaab.

Despite gains made by the African Union Mission in Somalia, and by Somali forces, al Shabaab retains the intent and capability to strike security, governmental, and civilian targets. This was illustrated in the horrific attack last October in Mogadishu that killed over 500 people, the single deadliest attack in recent Somali history.

These challenges are compounding a dire humanitarian situation. Moreover, persistent drought conditions mean the continued threat of widespread famine. Conflict, instability, and four consecutive failed rainy seasons have left 6.2 million people, roughly one half of the population, in need of humanitarian assistance, and has resulted in widespread internal displacement. Moreover, some 875,000 Somalis continue to live as refugees in neighbouring countries.

Against this backdrop, conditions for Somali women and girls are among the most difficult in the world, the combined result of acute poverty, conflict, and a clan-based culture that promotes male hierarchy and authority. Women and girls suffer from one of the highest rates of maternal mortality in the world. An overwhelming majority of women aged 15 to 49 have undergone female genital mutilation.

The situation in these three countries has resulted in Canada's engagement on multiple fronts, using a range of diplomatic, humanitarian, development, and security tools. At the heart of our engagement is the well-being and promotion of women and girls, a Government of Canada priority.

Canada recognizes that there is an opportunity, working alongside partners, to help realize the potential that exists in these extremely fragile states and their people. Our engagement comprises principled diplomacy at national, regional, and international levels. This is complemented by our international assistance, which is designed to reduce poverty by promoting peace and stability, fostering inclusive governance, saving lives, and protecting human dignity.

South Sudan and the DRC are the eighth and thirteenth largest recipients of Canadian international assistance, $115 million and $91 million in 2016-17, respectively. In the case of South Sudan, we are among the top five country donors. In Somalia, we provided $31 million in 2016-17, principally in the form of humanitarian assistance. Our assistance to these three countries includes Canada's institutional support to multilateral agencies such as UNICEF, as well as regional institutions such as the African Union.

Mr. Chair, distinguished members, I will now elaborate on what Canada is doing specifically in these three countries.

On peace and security, Canada has a long history of supporting peace and security on the continent and of accompanying peace processes in the region. This includes our contributions to the UN's peacekeeping budget, to which Canada is the ninth largest contributor in assessed contributions. Our current engagement includes renewed support for peacekeeping as well as a special effort to deliver on the commitments outlined in Canada’s national action plan on women, peace, and security.

In March, Minister of Foreign Affairs Chrystia Freeland announced $1.8 million to support the women, peace, and security agenda by preventing conflict-related sexual violence in Somalia, South Sudan, as well as Kenya. This includes working with Somali refugees in the Dadaab refugee camp.

Canada strongly believes that children should not be weapons of war. To this end, we support partners like UNICEF and the Roméo Dallaire Child Soldiers Initiative in all three countries to prevent the recruitment and use of child soldiers.

Canadian Armed Forces personnel are deployed to the United Nations Mission in South Sudan, UNMISS. ln addition, in 2017-18 Canada provided $2.7 million in security and stabilization support to South Sudan. Our support is helping to build political constituencies for a peaceful resolution of the crisis.

Canada has also been contributing to the United Nations Organization stabilization mission in the DRC (MONUSCO) since it was established in 1999.

In Somalia, Canada provides support to the UN Support Office in Somalia through our assessed contributions to the UN peacekeeping budget. Through our counterterrorism capacity building program, Canada is helping to provide Somalian police and security officials with relevant training to address terrorist threats. We have also partnered with local non-governmental organizations to target terrorist recruitment efforts among vulnerable populations.

I will now deal with governance and human rights.

Canada is also a leader in promoting inclusive governance and human rights, especially the rights of women and girls.

Canada, including our Minister of Foreign Affairs, has publicly expressed on numerous occasions our deep concern over continued gross violations of human rights in South Sudan. Furthermore, Canada has in place targeted sanctions against several South Sudanese individuals who've been involved in gross violations of human rights. This is in addition to the UN Security Council sanctions we implement against those threatening peace in South Sudan.

Canada is monitoring the political, security and human rights situation in the DRC very closely and capitalizes on opportunities to raise its concerns. Our efforts, which aim to encourage the democratic and peaceful transfer of power, respect for human rights and improvement in the security situation, have been made through press releases, as well as through our involvement in various international organizations.

Canada is also providing $10 million in funding from 2016 to 2020, to support a civic and voter education project designed to increase participation in the electoral process and in democratic life.

Somalia is in an important phase of building and strengthening its institutions. In line with this, Canada is supporting efforts by Somalian authorities to strengthen key economic institutions and implement sound microeconomic policies. This includes notably through a $2.5 million U.S. contribution to the International Monetary Fund's Somalia trust fund.

On human dignity, there can be no lasting and durable peace and stability without long-term sustainable and inclusive development. Canada's international assistance to South Sudan, the DRC, and Somalia seeks to help the poorest and most vulnerable populations, with the longer-term objective of building a more secure and sustainable future in the region.

Canada's assistance in South Sudan is focused on meeting the basic needs of the poorest and most vulnerable, particularly women and girls, while creating the conditions for durable peace and equitable development. This includes improving access to gender-sensitive health services, with a focus on promoting sexual and reproductive rights and fighting hunger by complementing the provision of emergency humanitarian assistance with the development of agricultural knowledge and skills. In addition, Canada has allocated $35 million to date, in 2018, to address humanitarian needs in the country.

In the DRC, our assistance is focused on gender equality, the rights of women and girls, combatting sexual and gender-based violence, health, protecting children, and promoting democracy. Canada has also allocated $39.5 million in humanitarian assistance for the DRC for 2018. This includes $2.5 million in emergency humanitarian aid to assist organizations that are fighting the outbreak of Ebola.

With the international community's support, Somalia has put in place a national development plan for the period 2017-19 for the first time in 30 years. Based on this plan, the New Partnership for Somalia was endorsed at the London Conference on Somalia last May, including by Canada. In April, the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship, Minister Hussen, announced an additional $18 million to address drought and conflict-related humanitarian needs in Somalia, which brings Canada's allocation to $25 million to date this year. Canada is also a strong supporter of multilateral organizations, with significant programming in Somalia, especially in health and education.

In closing, I can assure you we are conscious of the numerous challenges that these countries must overcome, and we are working tirelessly to help their populations improve their situation by taking a multi-faceted approach in order to maximize our impact.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Nault]

Thank you very much, Mr. Fredette.

Colleagues, we'll go straight to questions.

We'll start with Mr. Aboultaif, please.

[Ziad Aboultaif, Conservative, Edmonton Manning, AB]

Thank you very much.

I'll start by asking about South Sudan.

We know the war broke in December of 2013, and there continued to be a conflict between President Kiir and Machar at that time. Eventually it led to a civil war around Juba. We know how much this conflict affected the whole situation. Somehow IGAD, which is the Intergovernmental Authority on Development, has reached a peace agreement of sorts to basically put things in perspective, and in 2015 the parties signed this agreement. To come to this arrangement, there were efforts by many countries that were involved and, we can imagine, provided some political support, besides some development and financial support.

Where was Canada in this whole thing? Did Canada exist in supporting those efforts? Has Canada played a significant role? Can you name the countries that were more involved in getting this agreement?

[Marc-André Fredette]

Your analysis is quite right. However, frankly, it's becoming more complicated. There has been a succession of agreements and signatures on peace agreements. There's never been a fulsome, comprehensive agreement that was completely agreed to and completely implemented.

Going back to around last December, the last round was more promising, in the sense that it focused on a more stepwise approach. Let's start with a feasible and well-monitored ceasefire. Despite the horrors that unfold every day in South Sudan, considering the path of the last few years, this has been episodic but has been—the only way I can put this to you frankly is—less bad than previous years. In terms of the ceasefire, there continues to be a great deal of focus on this from the international community. Canada has been very involved in this. I hope you understand that very little of that is public, or can be public, because our best place in these things is to work behind the scenes.

I can certainly tell you, in respect for the office you represent, that we are very actively involved, particularly in some areas. In the most recent round that took place in Addis Ababa, the South Sudan Council of Churches got involved for the first time in a very proactive way to perform a form of mediation. South Sudan is a very religious country, despite the way some of them behave with each other. This is the point we had encouraged and facilitated—not directly, of course, but facilitated. Likewise, we are by far.... You ask anyone—if you look for optimism in Juba—about Canada's role in terms of ensuring that women are part of the peace process itself. We were the first to lead, with great support from other major international partners, in ensuring that women participate even in the discussions about how to create a fulsome, comprehensive peace agreement.

That's what should bear fruit, but frankly, it's going to be gradual. It will be laborious. We're also very involved, as you heard, on the question of child soldiers. Now there is, again, amidst a number of clouds, a few rays of sunshine. In recent months, if you follow the news on this, you will see that a number of child soldiers have been released, including quite recently—a couple of weeks ago.

It's a long, arduous path, but there is some modicum of progress and Canada is very involved behind the scenes. Our ambassador in Juba, who is not here with us today, also regularly travels through the region. He was present, in fact, behind the scenes in Addis Ababa, on the margins of this, to indeed facilitate and accompany, without being a party to the process.

What's increasingly difficult though, of course, is that there's a fragmentation among the players. You talked about the two historical big leaders, Kiir and Machar. What's happening now is increasing fragmentation within the clans. For instance, I was in Juba not too long ago. I was told they have 7,000 generals in a country of roughly 12 million people. I don't know how many the Canadian military has, but it means basically that you have roving gangs of militias who declare themselves to be an army and shift their alliances according to primarily economic interests, and sometimes ethnic and other resource-driven issues.

Secondly, you asked about other key players. Ethiopia is a significant player. They're the driving force behind the IGAD process, which is a regional organization. Where others play a role as well, Uganda has often played a role that's been, most of the time, quite useful. They host a huge number of South Sudanese refugees quite generously. Then you have other neighbouring countries who are involved in varying degrees and in various ways: Sudan, Egypt, and other countries in the region, such as Kenya.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Nault]

We'll go to Mr. Wrzesnewskyj, please.

[Borys Wrzesnewskyj, Liberal, Etobicoke Centre, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to speak to that point you made about Canada playing an important role behind the scenes but it's something that's best not discussed publicly. Perhaps we might have the opportunity for an in camera session at some point. I believe it's important, on issues of this sort, that the committee have an opportunity to be properly briefed if we're to provide recommendations to the government.

On to Somalia, how many Canadians, approximately, are there in Somalia at the present time?

[Marc-André Fredette]

This is one of those magical questions to which there are two very different answers. A few dozen of them are actually registered, but our estimates are in the multiples of thousands because a number of dual citizens—likewise for the United States and the U.K. as these are the three largest diasporas in the world—go back to their country of origin to volunteer and work for, really, a pittance for the new, emerging government, or with local NGOs, or local civil society organizations. Many of them have gone back to start businesses or to open private hospitals and schools. They don't register with us, so we don't know the fulsome answer to your question.

[Borys Wrzesnewskyj, Liberal, Etobicoke Centre, ON]

Thank you.

That's exactly why I asked this particular question, because in your report on Canada's involvement in Somalia there's no mention of the incredible work that's being done on the ground by the Somali Canadian diaspora. Perhaps, even more so than the Canadian government, it's the Somali Canadian diaspora that's making a difference on the ground.

I think this would also be quite informative. Do you have, perhaps, a table or a chart of all the various government officials in Somalia that would also indicate how many of them are Canadians?

[Marc-André Fredette]

We know that six ministers of the Somali government are dual citizens of Canada, including some very significant ones dealing with the Ministry of Planning, for instance, and the minister of women's affairs, so there's a huge connection there.

To your previous point, I want to fully acknowledge that we absolutely agree with you. The two reasons that I didn't mention this was of course because I'm here to represent Global Affairs Canada so I can tell you what we do, and secondly, more importantly, we actually do not know.

We are trying. We reach out to these people all the time, by the way, but it's very informal. When I was in Mogadishu not too long ago, I saw a hospital with a little Canadian flag on it. I was told informally an anecdote that this is some Somali citizen who is a successful businessman in Toronto, who opened a heavily subsidized private hospital in the middle of Mogadishu, but we don't know how much money he put into it. We don't know exactly how many people they treat. We have very little information about that.

[Borys Wrzesnewskyj, Liberal, Etobicoke Centre, ON]

Sure.

Mr. Fredette, I'm actually quite encouraged to hear that you've visited Mogadishu. We don't have an embassy in Mogadishu. We work out of Nairobi. How often does our ambassador travel to Mogadishu?

[Marc-André Fredette]

Our high commissioner in Nairobi, Ms. Sara Hradecky, travels quite frequently. I won't give you an average, because I would say in the past year it has vastly accelerated.

She came with me when I was there recently. Since the London conference, there's been a great deal of attention with regard to Somalia because, as I mentioned earlier in a somewhat pre-orchestrated manner, for the first time in 30 years there is something happening. It's incomplete, it's imperfect, but there's something significant happening, so we've been going in very frequently, subject to our security advisories. She's been there, I would say in the past year, almost once a month, or people from her staff also go.

[Borys Wrzesnewskyj, Liberal, Etobicoke Centre, ON]

Thank you.

That's encouraging because, as you mentioned, there may be a real window of opportunity in what was a situation of warlordism and anarchy for decades. There's the potential to do a lot of work. We have human resources on the ground, in fact. There are a lot of Canadians on the ground. We took on this engagement of trying to rebuild the police force.

What sorts of resources are we putting into that, both monetary and human resources?

[Marc-André Fredette]

Some of that of course is highly confidential, but it's certainly putting us in a good position compared with most other international partners in terms of not only the financial value of what we do, but.... I'm not here to wave the flag, but one thing I would add is that the RCMP has a reputation beyond what we realize here living in Canada.

I've spent much of my life abroad. It's also the quality of their training in terms of pragmatism, for instance, developing techniques such as community policing, which is something that is very well tested in Canada and which is highly valuable to our counterparts there. On your suggestion of in camera briefings later, if you want to have more details on the security-related investments and activities, we will be honoured to come back.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Nault]

Thank you, Mr. Wrzesnewskyj.

We'll go to Ms. Duncan, please.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you.

My first questions will be about the DRC. My understanding is, you can correct me if I'm wrong, that there is some level of assistance going there for women's health, particularly maternal care and so forth.

What degree of assistance is Canada giving to address AIDS?

[His Excellency Mr. Nicolas Simard, Ambassador of Canada to the Democratic Republic of Congo]

Thank you for your question.

Mr. Chair, I am pleased to be here with you. If I may, I will speak in French, because I work in French a lot in the DRC.

As for the DRC, we have indeed received a lot of development assistance in the area of health, a priority for Canada. In fact, our assistance is intended to strengthen the DRC's health systems. Because the systems have been strengthened, we are able to find support for the fight against AIDS. It is therefore a more general approach that is the result of supporting the DRC's national health systems.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

As I understand, we're assisting women's clinics on diagnosis, but are we providing medicines?

[Nicolas Simard]

That is an excellent question, and I thank you for it.

I must say that we have had projects to combat sexual violence in the DRC for a very long time. Through the United Nations Population Fund and the United Nations Development Program (UNDP), with which we work, we have a one-stop centre that provides women victims of sexual violence not only with medical support such as medication, but also with psychological support, legal support and economic support with a view to putting them back into the economic life of the country.

To answer your question more specifically, the support for these clinics comes from the UNDP and the United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA). There are also contributions in the form of medication.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I've been trying to read and catch up as much as I can, and I'm concerned by what I read about Canadian arms dealers selling indirectly to South Sudan. I know my colleague on this committee put forward an amendment that was rejected to stop the indirect sales; that is, in other words, if you sell to the U.S. and then they in turn sell it on to a banned nation. What is happening with arms sales from Canada to South Sudan now? Is that still going on, even indirectly?

[Marc-André Fredette]

Our position is, and has been, systematically clear. Canada has never issued any permits for the export of military goods, including, for instance, armoured vehicles to South Sudan that have made the headlines. As well, Canada stands behind all existing international efforts to implement an arms embargo in concert with the international community.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I said “indirect sales”.

[Marc-André Fredette]

Those things that are not under our purview, regulations, or legislation are exactly that.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Do we know if Canadian arms are still going into South Sudan, then?

[Marc-André Fredette]

We have no way of knowing.