Foreign Affairs Committee on April 10th, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

I'd like to call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 101 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development. Today’s meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the Standing Orders. Therefore, members are attending in person in the room as well as remotely using the Zoom application.

I'd like to make a few comments for the benefit of members and witnesses.

Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. You may speak in the official language of your choice.

Although this room is equipped with a powerful audio system, feedback events can occur. These can be extremely harmful to interpreters and cause serious injuries. The most common cause of sound feedback is an earpiece worn too close to a microphone.

I remind you that all comments should be addressed through the chair.

With regard to a speaking list, the committee clerk and I will do our best to maintain a consolidated order of speaking for all members.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted by the committee on Monday, January 29, 2024, the committee will commence its study of Canada’s approach to Africa.

I would now like to welcome all our witnesses.

From the Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development, we're grateful to have Ms. Cheryl Urban, assistant deputy minister; Ms. Caroline Delany, director general, southern and eastern Africa bureau; Ms. Apeksha Kumar, director, Maghreb and Egypt; Mr. Marcel Lebleu, director general, west and central Africa bureau; and Ms. Susan Steffen, director general, pan-Africa bureau.

In addition, we have, from the Department of National Defence, Major-General Gregory Smith, director general, international security policy.

I understand that Ms. Urban will speak on behalf of the Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development; and Major-General Smith will speak on behalf of the Department of National Defence. Each of you will be provided five minutes for your opening remarks, after which we will go to the members for questions.

Ms. Urban, you have five minutes for your opening remarks.

[Cheryl Urban, Assistant Deputy Minister, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development]

Thank you, Mr. Chair and members of the committee. I'm honoured to appear before you today. Eid Mubarak.

Thank you for this opportunity to update the committee on Canada's approach to Africa. The committee's study is timely as the department is thinking strategically about how to advance Canada's interest through our overall engagement with Africa.

Canada’s engagement is guided by the African Union’s strategic vision for the continent as captured in “Agenda 2063: The Africa We Want”. Canada’s partnership with Africa is anchored in our mutual priorities, informed by African solutions to African and global challenges.

As a vast, increasingly integrated continent made up of 54 countries, Africa is forecasted to be the world’s second fastest-growing region with 12 of the 20 fastest-growing economies in 2024. By 2050, 25% of the world's population will be living in Africa.

The continent has one of the world’s most diverse ecosystems and abundant resources, including 30% of the world’s critical minerals, 60% of the best solar resources globally, 25% of global biodiversity and larger carbon capture potential than the Amazon. These resources are key to the green transition and planetary health.

Africa also boasts the world's youngest population and fastest-growing middle class, providing a source of dynamism and vast market potential in stark contrast to many aging and declining populations elsewhere. With a projected net increase of 740 million people by 2050, the continent will see the fastest increase globally in working-age populations.

Youth play an important role in the continent. To fully contribute to the socio-economic development and security of their country, youth require access to education, jobs and support for entrepreneurship.

In recent years, there has been significant economic growth across the continent; however, growth has not always been inclusive or evenly distributed. Africa houses countries with high-performing economies, but also houses some of the poorest countries in the world, with 60% of the world's extreme poor living in sub-Saharan Africa. Under current conditions, almost all of the world's least developed countries will be in Africa as of 2030.

Deterioration of democracy in some countries, conflicts, inadequate infrastructure and climate change, coupled with unsustainably high national debts, make achieving the sustainable development goals a challenge.

Africa is set to see 13 national elections before the end of 2024, and Canada is watching closely. Canada is actively supporting democratic governance and electoral processes in Africa through several streams at work. This includes participating in electoral observation missions and one-on-one advocacy with governments in the region on the importance of democracy and strong institutions.

Canada recognizes the key role played by human rights defenders in protecting and promoting human rights. These advocates often belong to groups that face discrimination, including but not limited to women and LGBTI individuals. Canada supports their work through advocacy initiatives and international assistance.

With its 54 countries, Africa is strategically important amidst growing polarization globally, changing multilateral collaboration and evolving global value chains. African leaders are diversifying their international partnerships and fostering stronger relationships with global economic powers like China and India, partners like Turkey and the Gulf States, and, in some cases, engaging in open military relationships with Russia. They are doing this bilaterally and through multilateral fora such as BRICS and the G20.

Canada and our G7 partners are collaborating to ensure that G7 countries maintain and strengthen their partnerships on the continent through strengthened diplomatic engagement, infrastructure initiatives and more targeted international assistance to encourage investment in Africa. The most recent example of this is the priority Italy is placing on Africa as part of their G7 presidency this year.

Canadian trade and investment with Africa has witnessed impressive growth over the last five years, with two-way trade in merchandise totalling $16.2 billion in 2023 and investments on the continent reaching $16 billion in 2022. This is supported by the work of our trade commissioner service network.

A large share of Canadian direct investment in Africa is in the mining sector. Africa is also home to the second-highest value of Canadian mining assets after the Americas.

Canada also has eight foreign investment promotion and protection agreements in Africa, and these provide Canadian investors with greater protection, increased predictability and better projections for developing their economies.

In terms of international assistance, Canada is and will remain a leader and trusted partner in gender equality and feminist approaches in Africa. With the feminist international assistance policy, we have put gender equality and the empowerment of all women and girls at the heart of our international assistance efforts as the most effective way to foster a more peaceful, inclusive and prosperous world.

In Africa, Canada is navigating a dynamic security landscape. In some areas, including violent extremist insurgencies, a rise in terrorism and military coups, we are responding through a range of policy and programming efforts. This is complemented by our international engagement with the African Union and leadership in UN bodies such as the Peacebuilding Commission and Special Committee on Peacekeeping Operations.

We have had a number of engagements. The Minister of Foreign Affairs, for example, recently engaged with her African counterparts, including calls with Kenya, South Africa and Benin, and she will meet with senior African Union officials this week. We also interact with the African diaspora in Canada, with the private sector and non-state actors.

We are hearing that Africans want to improve their terms of engagement. They seek to move beyond the traditional donor-aid recipient relationship to mutually beneficial partnerships, including in trade, investment—

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Ms. Urban, could I ask that you wrap it up?

[Cheryl Urban]

I am done.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you, Ms. Urban. I am very grateful.

We now go to Major-General Smith.

Likewise, you have five minutes.

[Major-General Gregory Smith, Director General, International Security Policy, Department of National Defence]

Mr. Chair, members of the committee, I'm honoured to appear before you today. Thank you for this opportunity to update the committee on Canada's approach to Africa.

As you know, the Minister of National Defence announced Canada's updated defence policy, “Our North, Strong and Free” on Monday. As outlined in the document, the Canadian Armed Forces is making, and will continue to make, meaningful contributions around the world as part of coalition-based or multilateral initiatives, including in Africa, to help address growing global instability and advance Canada's foreign policy.

On the continent, our enduring commitment to United Nations peace operations and working in partnership with regional organizations like the African Union reflects the fundamental importance of these multilateral efforts to preserve international peace and security. To this end, the Department of National Defence and the Canadian Armed Forces continue to maintain a variety of engagements in the region.

For instance, Canada currently provides staff officers to the United Nations mission in South Sudan, UNMISS, and the United Nations organization stabilization mission in the Democratic Republic of the Congo, MONUSCO. There are also 39 Canadian Armed Forces members currently deployed with the non-UN Multinational Force and Observers, MFO, in Egypt's Sinai Peninsula.

The Royal Canadian Air Force provides tactical airlift support to France in Africa under Operation Frequence and to UN peacekeeping missions under Operation Presence. We work with Ghana as our primary bilateral partner in Africa for the Elsie initiative, a Canada-led project that aims to increase the meaningful participation of uniformed women in United Nations peacekeeping operations.

We further maintain a network of eight Canadian defence attachés plus supporting staff to manage defence relations across the continent, both with regional partners and with our international allies. For example, in support of the Sahel, we continue to maintain bilateral defence relationships with coastal West African countries to help curb the spread of terrorism in the region.

I would also note that Canada is currently fulfilling the function of NATO contact point embassy for the African Union. Through this role we have had the opportunity to work with the department of political affairs, peace and security of the African Union Commission on its partnership with NATO.

Furthermore, DND and the Canadian Armed Forces deliver episodic capacity development training to several African countries through its military training and co-operation program, MTCP. These training courses include topics such as combat medicine and enable partners to function better together on peacekeeping operations with the United Nations and with other multinational organizations.

These efforts underpin our diplomatic efforts around the world, helping to uphold the international order and supporting our African partner nations. We remain committed to leveraging existing operations and initiatives to help strengthen their capacities.

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you, Major-General Smith.

We now open it up to members and we start off with Mr. Aboultaif.

You have six minutes, sir.

[Ziad Aboultaif, Conservative, Edmonton Manning, AB]

Thank you, Chair, and thanks to the witnesses, welcome to the committee.

In a September 2022 paper, the Africa Study Group argued that Canada's engagement with Africa should be informed by two principles: that Canada needs Africa as much as Africa needs Canada, and that Canada should move away from donor-recipient models to one based on relationships between and among equal partners.

The question is, what exactly is Canada's strategy for Africa, and whether we agree that we should move to a different model if the model we have right now is not working as we wish it to be?

[Cheryl Urban]

There are a number of reasons that it is in Canada's interest to reinforce our partnerships with countries in Africa and to increasingly have those relationships on a peer-to-peer basis. This is indeed what African stakeholders are seeking, and it's the result of consultations we've undertaken in Canada and in Africa.

I'll break down a little better what is in the Canadian interest and say that, in terms of the Canadian strategy, we have a good history to build on. We have had a presence in Africa for a long time, and a very strong international assistance presence. As I mentioned, with the economic growth in Africa there are increasingly other opportunities for Canada and Canadians, especially in the medium term, when it comes to economic co-operation.

One predominant reason it's in Canadians' interest is that it is a clear way for Canada and the international community to address climate change. I mentioned in my speech that Africa has carbon capture potential. It has 25% of global diversity and 60% of the best solar resources that exist. If Canada partners and engages with Africa—including, for example, in green energy—this is a win-win solution for all of us, for Canada and for Africa.

Another is that partnering with African countries in order to maintain influence will be in Canada's interest. We already know that organizations multilaterally, such as the BRICS and the G20, are growing in influence. There are international organizations that are shifting, and you can even see at the UN Security Council that there are groups that are voting certain ways, and so for Canada to forge strong bilateral relationships with African countries will help us to build like-minded views.

Another is that there is an opportunity for us to foster even more Canadian prosperity. I have mentioned that it is the fastest-growing economy. The African Continental Free Trade Area provides potential for stronger inter-African trade, which will also create opportunities for Canadian businesses. The potential economic market is of $2 trillion to $3 trillion. Another, as I mentioned, are mining assets, so Canada has an interest in co-operation economically.

Security and stability are also very important to Canada and something we can focus on. There is the risk of terrorism. There's also a risk to Canadians who are travelling in Africa. There is an important reason for Canada to engage with the international community and with African partners to help them address some of their challenges with insecurity, and we can do so in a number of ways. Examples include partnering through defence and security, and providing them with international assistance, as some of that insecurity arises from the lack of social safety nets for poorer populations, for example, in the north of some western African countries.

Finally, we have people-to-people ties—

[Ziad Aboultaif, Conservative, Edmonton Manning, AB]

Political stability is a very important factor in doing business. We do about $16 billion of merchandise trade, which, with a population of 1.2 billion, is very minimal. Where are we going, as far as investment in that region? What is the plan of the department to make sure we have a better, bigger and more impactful role?

[Cheryl Urban]

We have peace and security programming that we provide through Global Affairs Canada—there are a number of initiatives under way—and we have partnerships with African countries that are best practices. The major-general mentioned that we have the Elsie initiative; women, peace and security; and an ambassador, who was recently travelling in Africa, who was speaking to African leaders and communities about that.

It might really hit it home if I turn to some of my colleagues to provide concrete examples. This is an important element of our activities presently, and it also will be part of future engagement that we undertake within Africa.

[Ziad Aboultaif, Conservative, Edmonton Manning, AB]

During a visit to Nigeria, I was told by one of our diplomats, “We need the minister here more. We need more presence, visits and activities.” It's a very important region and the focus should be on growing in all directions there. Is the department doing enough? Is the government doing enough?

[Cheryl Urban]

There have been a number of high-level visits recently by Minister Hussein to Benin, DRC, Rwanda, Kenya, Zambia, Mozambique and Madagascar. Minister Sajjan has gone to Rwanda, Tanzania and Egypt. Minister Ng had a virtual trade mission in February 2022. Minister Joly was in Kenya earlier, and there have been a number of high-level visits of parliamentarians and parliamentary secretaries and speakers. There is a high level of engagement and I agree that high-level engagement is an important component of engaging with Africa.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you for that.

We now go to Dr. Fry for six minutes.

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you very much for coming and talking to us.

There are so many questions to ask. I only have six minutes to ask them.

I want to start by saying that we've engaged closely in partnership with the African Union. We have engaged closely in all kinds of bilateral things with countries like Ghana that we think we can work with, but has anything really seemed to work? Africa is still the continent that's most poor. It still has a lot of security issues. We talk about women, peace and security. Is it working in Africa? There is so much war. There is so much insecurity and so much conflict. How can you, even with the best of intentions and the greatest amount of money, cut through all of that disrespect for human rights, that anger, that sense of people not trusting each other and the lack of democratic institutions that Mr. Aboultaif talked about?

There are so many things that we're doing. Are we making any impact? We've been working for so long; a decade is a long time. Have we been impacting anything? What do we need to do? Do we need to shift our focus? Africa remains the single most important, can I say, pimple on the face of the earth because it does not value human rights, and it has lots of conflict. Climate change is unbelievable there. People are poor. There's a lack of opportunity.

Can we shift what we're doing? Should we shift what we're doing? That's a question I want to ask. I know it's an open-ended question, but I want it to be open-ended because I want to have an open-ended answer. I want you to blue-sky it for me.

[Cheryl Urban]

Thank you very much. I'll start off, and my colleagues can add, if they would like to contribute.

You're right that there are significant challenges on the continent, but it is really a mixture of different types of countries. There are countries that are thriving, doing well and showing strong global leadership, and there are countries that have fallen into situations of extreme insecurity and humanitarian situations, so you can't paint it with one brush. There are good success stories that we can look at and that everyone can learn from in terms of what African countries have achieved.

I mentioned with BRICS, with the G20 and the AU joining that African leaders are stepping up globally, having greater influence and shifting that around the world.

I attended the Africa Climate Summit in September 2023, and African leaders were there. They were having a stronger voice at COP.

You also see, for example, in western Africa, the threat of terrorism. Some countries have experienced coups and have problems, but there are the predominantly coastal countries that remain strong and that are investing in the north of their countries.

I was just in Côte d'Ivoire and in Benin. It's remarkable that some of that leadership is technocratic and investing not only in security but in social services, recognizing the complexity of what they need to achieve.

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

My question is not what Africa is doing on its own with strong leadership in some of its countries.

Should we revisit how we work in Africa and what we do in Africa? I don't believe that it's working as well as it could. Should we reinvent this wheel and talk about a different way of engaging with Africa, and if so, what should that way be?

[Cheryl Urban]

In terms of Canada's investments and what we've undertaken, I believe that we are having an impact through the feminist international assistance policy. Canada has really carved out a niche for itself helping women and girls, focusing on education and on women's and girls' health, and we do see results. If you look at the documents, the departmental results report and the international assistance report, you can see what some of the results are for the investments that we have made.

Canada, even in international organizations, is pushing very hard and is recognized for how it is helping to push forward the agenda of women and girls on the continent and elsewhere.

I think that this committee will be undertaking a study on engagement in Africa, and I think that's very timely. This is the time for everybody to be reflecting, because the global environment is so dynamic, and the state of how things are in development in African countries continues to be dynamic. This is the time to take another look. This is what we were doing as a department and what the Senate committee is doing as well to determine the best way.

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

If I have time, Chair, I have one last question.

We cannot be everything to Africa because of the disparate nature of all the different countries and their needs.

What do you think of the idea to focus only on some things that we do well? I have my ideas of what those could be, including health and the feminist assistance policy, climate change and human rights.

Should we just focus on some things and get results from some things, as opposed to casting this wide net to cover everything and not getting very much done?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Answer in less than 30 seconds, please.

[Cheryl Urban]

I had spoken at length about what the Canadian interests are in terms of engaging, but there's also the question of what the Canadian strengths are that we can leverage on the continent.

Canada has a number of strengths. We have a strong education sector. We have good mining, agriculture, green tech and ICT. As the committees and the department explore how we can refine our engagement in those countries, we can look not only at building on our strengths in our existing focus on gender equality, women and girls, but also increasingly leveraging our Canadian strengths.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

We next go to Mr. Bergeron.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to thank the witnesses for being here and for their very enlightening comments and answers.

The general observation is that western countries have removed Africa from their priorities in recent decades, and since politics abhors a vacuum, powers like Russia and China rushed to move in. We saw the consequences of that when the United Nations was voting on the war in Ukraine, and a number of African countries voted against resolutions or abstained from voting in favour of resolutions denouncing the Russian aggression into Ukraine. Western countries need to reinvest in Africa. I'll come back to that a little later.

I'd say that Africa is the continent of the future, economically speaking. So Canada absolutely needs to invest in Africa. In 2022, our esteemed colleague the parliamentary secretary was tasked with establishing and defining a strategy for Africa. In 2023-24, the departmental plan talked instead about a new strategic framework without really providing any details. The 2024-25 departmental plan no longer even refers to a framework; it talks about intensifying Canada's engagement with countries in sub-Saharan Africa, with special emphasis on economic co-operation.

You made no mention in your presentation of the strategy or the framework. Where are we at? Do we have a strategy? Do we have a framework in place, or has it simply reverted back to a desire to enhance our relations in terms of economic co-operation, particularly with sub-Saharan Africa?

[Cheryl Urban]

It was in Minister Ng's mandate letter that we should have a strategy for economic co-operation for Africa. Following that, a lot of work was undertaken by Parliamentary Secretary Oliphant in order to get out there. We did a whole series of extensive consultations in Canada and Africa with a view to getting input into how we can think about engagement with African countries.

That took place over a long period of time. We have brought pulled together the information we have. We have reviewed it and are at the moment looking at that and articulating how that can inform a Canadian strategy.

It coincides with studies that are also being done by this committee and the Senate committee as well.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

I'm sorry to belabour some points, but this is just to enlighten us. Have we reverted back to the words “African strategy”, a framework or simply a willingness to intensify our relations with sub-Saharan Africa?

Please enlighten us, because I must say that it's hard to make heads or tails of this. I myself have been completely lost over the past few years. I no longer know what the government's intentions are with respect to Africa.