Foreign Affairs Committee on May 16th, 2022

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

It sounds as if you are, Mr. Genuis, and I raise that as a point of order because if you're challenging the chair, we have to call a vote on your challenge of the chair.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

Mr. Genuis just made clear that he wasn't, so I'm going to ask him to continue now.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I think I've make my point with respect to the matters of order, and I'll get back to the issue of food security, briefly.

I know many members have raised, in the context of how urgent the discussion of Ukraine is and the need for this committee to get to its work on Ukraine, that what is happening in Ukraine has global implications with respect to food security and access to food. I want to note a few things from an article on this.

Actually, I should start, with respect to food security, by just reading out a tweet from my colleague in the NDP. It's something I agree with. She said, “We need to talk about catastrophic food shortages around the world right now! Food security is an urgent issue! This is a threat to human life and a serious security risk everywhere. We can deal with this crisis appropriately and timely now or we will 1000x in the future.” I think that's prescient in that it relates very much to the work we need to do on Ukraine.

I'll quote from a news article:

Russia's invasion of Ukraine has sent food commodity prices soaring in March to the highest levels ever recorded, bringing to the forefront the global implications of its military offensive on the former breadbasket of the Soviet Union.

As Moscow refocuses its military efforts on Ukraine's east, readying massive forces for part two of its offensive, analysts have warned a Russian takeover of Ukraine's ports and most fertile stretch of land will have repercussions on Ukraine’s food exports to be felt the world over.

I think that's an important part of the context.

Mr. Chair, at this point I'll yield the floor and happily listen to the comments of other members. Thank you very much.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

Thank you, Mr. Genuis.

I must apologize, Ms. McPherson, for not taking into account your anniversary when I made my decision earlier. I do, however, want to wish you a happy anniversary, and I have no doubt the committee members join me in wishing you a wonderful end of the day.

Now, over to you, Ms. McPherson.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Why, thank you, Mr. Chair.

I will say that it would perhaps not be my preference to spend my anniversary with all of you, as much as I enjoy you all very much. Hopefully, I will get an opportunity to see my husband of 21 years very soon.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear!

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I'm not going to take up very much time. I'm not interested in filibustering this committee, but I want to say a few things that are very important that I want on the record.

This motion that came forward from Dr. Fry is not time-bound. We can study this in the fall. We don't have to do it right now. We have the opportunity to look at this. This committee has very clearly used this way of bringing forward studies. In fact, it was my study in December on Ukraine that I brought forward to this committee that started the study on Ukraine. Ms. Bendayan brought forward a study on Ukraine to make sure we were looking at this.

Nobody in this room thinks a study on Ukraine is not vital, which is why we have been undertaking it. If you look around this room at the number of people who are celebrating Ukrainian culture and Ukrainian history and honouring Ukrainians today, it is very apparent, so nobody is saying that.

In fact, what we could do is vote, in probably less than one minute, on this motion that is before us to look at this issue going forward, to look at reproductive health for women around the world, something that is vitally important. The member for Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan seems to think it's a ploy. The member for Halton Hills seems to think that trade is more important and that it is not important, but I have to say that, realistically, on the attacks on women's reproductive rights in the United States, the Supreme Court leak is one aspect of it. There are multiple states where women's rights are being undermined; there are multiple places around the world, including Ukraine. There are problems with reproductive access in this country, for people in this country. People sitting at this table have constituents who have no access to reproductive health. It is a vitally important issue.

It is offensive to me as a mother of a 17-year-old daughter. I want to make sure I do everything I can to fight for her to always have access to the full range of reproductive services. How could I come to this place and fight for the reproductive rights of my daughter without fighting for the reproductive rights of every 17-year-old girl in this world? How could I do that? My daughter has a right to get an abortion if she needs one. Everyone's daughter decides how they choose to use their body and how they choose to act, because you know what? Do you know what we call an animal that doesn't have control over their reproduction? Livestock. We call them livestock.

The member for Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan did one other thing the other day that deeply disturbed me. I would urge him to ask himself whether or not it would be worthy for him to apologize. He mocked gender identity. He chose a political opportunity to mock people who do not identify in cisnormative ways according to his description.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

You have a point of order, Mr. Genuis.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

On a point of order, Mr. Chair, the member is attacking my character and saying things that are simply not true. I'm happy to comment further on the context of what I think she's referring to, but the allegation she's making is totally baseless. Respectfully, it's just wrong.

I don't know if the committee will allow me to comment on that or if they'll see it as a point of debate—

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

With all due respect, Mr. Genuis, that's more a point of debate, and you've asked to be on the speaking list.

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

It's not a point of order.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

You'll get the chance to share your views on the member's arguments.

Carry on, Ms. McPherson.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Mr. Chair, I respect your ruling, but I would ask if you could clarify: Are there no limits to what a member can say about another member and to a member's insulting another member—falsely?

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

There are limits, and you know them. If you feel your privileges as a member have been breached, you know what has to happen next. At this point, I consider it to be simply a point of debate, a point of disagreement between two members of Parliament.

I encourage you to express your opinion when you have the floor again.

We are listening, Ms. McPherson.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

To summarize and to finish, I just want to say one thing: We could pass this immediately. This is an important motion for us to bring forward. This is an important thing for this committee to look at, and I am prepared to listen to hours upon hours of Conservative men telling me what I should think about reproductive health in this world so that it comes to a vote.

I would point out that it is in fact Mr. Chong's motion about Taiwan that we can't get to today because of the Conservative filibuster. I would point out that it is Mr. Genuis's private member's legislation that we will not be talking about today because of Mr. Genuis's filibustering this committee.

We could get to our work on Ukraine. We could get to our work on vaccine equity. We could get to our work on Taiwan. We could do so many things that need to happen in this committee, and we're not doing that because the Conservatives refuse to vote.

If they actually believe that this is not a study we should undertake, vote that way. Let's get it done.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

Thank you, Ms. McPherson.

Go ahead, Mrs. Stubbs.

[Shannon Stubbs, Conservative, Lakeland, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Not being a permanent member, I just want to say that it's my pleasure to be able to join all of you here in this committee. It's nice to see all of you.

It is, I guess, exactly for the reason that it is Vyshyvanka Day that we should be having this debate and showing Ukrainian Canadians in every corner of this country that it's not just an empty gesture of people wearing cultural clothes and it's not that all the permanent members of this committee are prepared to do is to do that instead of taking seriously their influence, the impact and their responsibility to address this crucial and urgent issue of the attack on Ukraine.

It has been almost three months since Putin first attacked. Of course, for years before that, he was building up troops and Conservatives were calling for government action. It was earlier in the new year that Conservatives called for exactly what the president of Ukraine asked for, which was the provision of lethal weapons so that Ukrainians could defend themselves.

I believe—I think it's true—that the solidarity and sincerity among all members of Parliament in the Canadian House of Commons across all parties are legitimate. I want to believe everybody who says they want to protect Ukrainians against the unjust and illegal attack by Putin, not just because of the role that Canada can play in securing peace and freedom for our allies—Canada being the country that was the first to recognize the independence of Ukraine and to carry that legacy and our own national heritage—but also, obviously, in support and in defence of the very real impact of the attack on Ukraine to Canadians themselves, to Ukrainian Canadians in every corner of this country.

I happen to represent a riding that is in the top five of where Ukrainian Canadians live. I grew up in the county of Lamont, just south of a tiny village in what is known as the cradle of Ukrainian settlement in Canada, the home of the first 125 Ukrainian families to settle in our country. I'm not Ukrainian, but I married into a Ukrainian family, and you will all know that you become one by osmosis because of the tight-knit relationships, the self-reliance and carrying on the traditions of providing for each other and caring for each other among Ukrainian Canadians.

This is a debate that is obviously crucial and urgent, and it's an emergency in terms of foreign affairs policy overall, but it's also deeply important, personal and urgent for Canadians, so it seems to me that it's exactly why the members of this committee should prioritize finishing the work you initiated in regard to the attack on Ukraine. Frankly, I think that if you don't pursue this work as the urgent priority that it is, then in terms of our gestures, our words and the solidarity that we pledge, it's really very empty, isn't it?

I would implore all of the members across all of the parties in this committee to continue to do the vital and urgent work on Putin's attack on Ukraine. I urge you to take seriously all of the very impactful roles that you can each have to make concrete and constructive solutions and recommendations for how Canada can assist Ukrainians fleeing Ukraine under attack and, also, of course, in the service of the Ukrainian Canadians whom so many of us represent. It is very obvious to me that this should be the top priority for the foreign affairs committee right now.

I want to recognize the efforts and the work undertaken by the Canadian government so far. We've supported the imposition of sanctions and a number of other measures, but there is no denying that there are still major challenges in terms of Canada's response to aid the people of Ukraine and particularly to aid the people and families who want to come to Canada for peace, freedom and security. A couple of those areas really require your dedicated work and co-operation and the redoubling of your efforts, your hearts and your minds to this issue that is so necessary, because there continue to be major projects despite the efforts the government has made so far.

I would just point out the issues around the promised expedited visa program. Of course, Conservatives called for visa-free travel, but the reality is that this so-called expedited visa program is taking months. It is extremely bureaucratic. In many cases, it is just absolutely impossible for Ukrainians to access the program and to meet the requirements. It requires your work to make the recommendations to improve that program.

There are a number of other promises related to the three-year work or study program for Ukrainians, as well as extended visa stays and open work permits for Ukrainians who are already in Canada and can't go home. For example, there are still no details related to the April 9 announcement about this financial support for hotel accommodations and income support. That announcement was made in April, and there are no details on that program or real funding for Ukrainian refugees who have been here for months. That's an urgent issue that your committee ought to study and make recommendations on to improve.

Again, we take this at face value. I think all the members of the party believe this to be true, but the government and Liberal members of Parliament have said they want to ensure that there's urgent processing of travel documents. The reality is, that hasn't materialized. There are no realistic and concrete improvements that work for the people of Ukraine fleeing the terror and the attacks from Putin. That's a major problem that I think deserves your attention and your recommendation.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Mr. Chair, I have a point of order.

[Shannon Stubbs, Conservative, Lakeland, AB]

Not to put too fine a point on it, the truth is that the Samaritan's Purse has successfully airlifted more Ukrainians.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

I'd like to hear what Mr. Sarai has to say, Mrs. Stubbs.

Go ahead, Mr. Sarai.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

I'm trying to understand the relevance of this. We're not talking about the motion at hand. We're talking about a study we have already done and perhaps another one that could be done. I fail to understand how talking about what's happening in Russia or Ukraine has any relevance to the motion request by Dr. Fry or any amendment to it. We can talk about anything at any time, but it has to have some relevance to what we're dealing with.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Stéphane Bergeron]

Thank you for your comments, Mr. Sarai, but as you know, tradition holds that the chair interpret the rule of relevance quite broadly.

Mrs. Stubbs, I would be especially grateful if you would focus your remarks on the substance of the motion as much as possible.

Thank you, Mrs. Stubbs. You may carry on with your comments.

[Shannon Stubbs, Conservative, Lakeland, AB]

I think all of this context is extremely relevant and important to the question about finishing the work on the escalating situation in Ukraine.

As I mentioned, the reality is that the Samaritan's Purse has successfully airlifted Ukrainians under attack into Canada more in the last three months than the Government of Canada has done. That, given no end in sight to the attacks that have already been going on for the last three months, again merits your urgent attention to and prioritization of this issue.

I just want to close by telling you a little about the experience of a teenager in Vegreville. Members in this committee would note, of course, that the Liberals closed the highest-performing and most effective citizenship and immigration processing centre in that very community of Vegreville, which is also a community of long-time Ukrainian families and settlement. I guess it is ironic in the worst possible way, and tragic, really, that there continue to be these visa processing holdups, lags and backlogs in the system.

[Rob Oliphant, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

Mr. Chair, on a point of order, I know you've ruled a few times on relevance. This one is now way off anything to do with the adjournment motion, the amendment, the motion, or the foreign affairs committee as it stands. I can't see any relevance whatsoever.

I would hope that you would rule on that.