Evidence of meeting #23 for Foreign Affairs and International Development in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was russia.
A recording is available from Parliament.
NDP
Heather McPherson NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I appreciate your comment, Mr. Bergeron, but I do just want to highlight that the members of the government had brought this issue up during their questions already, so I think it is fair.
I would like to see, obviously, a little bit more decorum within our committee so that we are not speaking over each other. If that could be managed, Mr. Chair, I think that would be great, but I do think it is reasonable for us to ask these questions. They are relevant and timely because, of course, the government has had an opportunity to ask those questions already.
Thank you.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Marty Morantz
As chair, of course I would like people to stay on topic, although historically there's been a fairly wide latitude when it comes to these types of things. I do recall that, at the beginning of Minister Joly's statement, she said that we're here to discuss Putin's war of choice, so I'm presuming other topics related to the brutal invasion by Russia are in order.
Mr. Genuis, you can have the floor. I have you with one more minute left.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I would like to provide a notice of motion to the committee,
The committee request that all documents in the possession of the government of Canada related to the assessed risk to non-Canadians employed at Canadian diplomatic missions in Ukraine at any time in the last 18 months be provided to the committee within 30 days of the adoption of this motion.
That's a notice of motion; I'm not moving it.
Additionally, just in the time I have left, I've been struck by all this talk about the allies, the alliance being united, and about how we need to have the alliance united.
Minister Joly, very directly, is Ukraine an ally of Canada in your view?
Conservative
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Ukraine is taking, very directly and sharply, a different position from Canada. Clearly the alliance is divided if Ukraine is part of the alliance.
Liberal
Mélanie Joly Liberal Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC
No, I don't think that the alliance is divided. I think we have to be steadfast in unity. Sometimes—
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Is Ukraine part of the alliance, Minister?
Liberal
Mélanie Joly Liberal Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC
Do you want me to answer your questions, Garnett, or do you want to cut me off every single time?
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Minister, is Ukraine part of the alliance?
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
That's my question, Minister.
Is Ukraine part of the alliance?
Liberal
Mélanie Joly Liberal Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC
Ukraine is an ally, and we are all standing with Ukraine. Our goal is to continue to support them.
Now maybe we'll be able to get an answer from you, because James didn't answer before. Is it the position of the Conservative Party of Canada that the turbine should not have been sent back to Germany?
Conservative
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Marty Morantz
Your round is up, unfortunately, Mr. Genuis.
Mr. Sorbara, you have the floor for five minutes.
Liberal
Francesco Sorbara Liberal Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON
Thank you, Chair.
It's great to see you, Marty, and great to see my colleagues today.
It's ironic that the Conservatives would bring up the issue and talk about division on a day when Canada announced that it would be sending 225 of our Canadian Armed Forces members over to Europe to help train the Ukrainian soldiers to fight Putin's unjust, unwarranted, unprovoked war against the Ukrainian people. We will always stand with the Ukrainian people shoulder to shoulder and side by side as we continue this journey together. It's going to be a long one.
I use the word “long” specifically because I do wish to talk about.... On July 16, 2022, Josep Borrell put out a blog. He is the high representative of the EU for foreign affairs and security policy. In his blog, he commented about the need for strategic patience—that is, the need for Europe to transition away from Russian energy dependence, whether it's oil and gas and even, to a certain extent, coal, and to transition to alternative suppliers, including many countries in Africa, the Middle East, including Kazakhstan as well, for some energy consumers, including Italy and Germany, and also for Canada to play a role in that obviously green transition.
I do wish to ask Minister Wilkinson first, how is Canada—I don't want to say “positioning itself”, because it has been doing so for many years—specifically aiding Europe on the LNG front in its transition to more secure, democratically oriented suppliers of energy and also to the transition to green? I'll then have a follow-up question for Minister Joly, please.
Liberal
Jonathan Wilkinson Liberal North Vancouver, BC
Thank you, Mr. Sorbara.
Let me start by saying that Europe is very focused essentially on moving away from Russian oil and gas. They've set a target that, by the end of this year, they will have found ways to move away from oil. Ideally, Germany has said that by the end of 2024, or thereabouts, they will be off Russian gas. Of course, they've made progress along the way.
Canada is certainly working with Germany and the European Union to be a part of helping them to do that, part of which is the expansion of oil and gas production that we are working on right now with the sector. We are on track with respect to the additional 300,000 barrels a day, which will help with increasing supply around the world.
As you know, we also have two LNG facilities in western Canada, one that is under construction and one that has been approved. Apparently construction will start next year, which will provide additional supplies into the market, which again will help with respect to displacing Russian gas.
We're looking at a number of potential sites in eastern Canada that could meet the window. Let's be clear: It has to be something that can be done within the next three or four years, or it will be outside the window of what will help Europe this way.
We're also working with Europe on other transitional elements of it, which is hydrogen. There is enormous work going on in Newfoundland and Labrador, for example, on hydrogen that will be used to displace gas and eventually will displace gas entirely as they work towards the 2045 net-zero commitment that Germany has.
Canada is intimately engaged. As you know, the German Chancellor is visiting us later this month, and the head of the European Union is coming a month after that to have exactly these conversations.
Liberal
Francesco Sorbara Liberal Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON
Thank you, Minister Wilkinson.
I will now go to Minister Joly.
Minister Joly, for the last 48 hours or so you met with your German equivalent and counterpart. I would like you to touch on these discussions, because unity and the relationship between Canada and the European Union and Canada and Germany is so important. I would like to hear some colour on those conversations.
Liberal
Mélanie Joly Liberal Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC
Thank you, Francesco.
I think there is a reckoning on the part of the German government that for too long they relied on cheap gas and that the conditions have completely changed and that we need to do more “friend-shoring” and work more amongst allies when it comes to energy and to critical minerals. That's why there is a lot of openness on the part of Germany to invest in Canada, to do so in a way also that is in line with our climate agenda. That is why it is, yes, about liquefied natural gas, as mentioned by Jonathan, and also a lot about hydrogen, and the type of hydrogen, so green hydrogen.
I think while Germany is looking at dealing with its own energy security issues right now, it is also looking at doing the green transition more quickly than expected.
At the same time, what is happening in Europe is that there is now a clear solidarity approach when it comes to dealing with Russian gas. All 26 members will be there to support a country should it have an energy capacity issue.
We are also working with the Americans to find solutions. The question of energy security has never been so central to our foreign policy. That's why Jonathan and I talk to each other pretty much every day.