Foreign Affairs Committee on April 27th, 2023

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

Thank you for that clarification, Ms. Keeling.

Could you further clarify whether there is any resource allocation required for this to be implemented, and clarify the impact of the broad scope of the information that's being disclosed?

[Jennifer Keeling]

Without seeing the exact wording of the text, I would say, based on listening to what has been presented on the table, that this would likely increase the financial and human resources needed to prepare such a report and a list.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

Thank you.

I would like just one further clarification.

I know that, from a government perspective, human rights reporting currently is undertaken by Canadian Heritage, if I'm not mistaken . For example, the UN and all the treaty reporting is undertaken by Canadian Heritage. I think when we change it from “Minister” to “government”, the assumption is that it's whatever organ of the government is charged with this. Would this be Canadian Heritage, or would this be Global Affairs?

[Jennifer Keeling]

You're correct that Canadian Heritage would lead on the reporting that would go to the UN about our domestic implementation of human rights. That's a job undertaken between the Department of Canadian Heritage, the Department of Justice and Global Affairs Canada. It would be hard to say for certain. In those cases where we're reporting to treaty bodies and where we're reporting to the UN on Canada's own domestic implementation of the treaties we have signed onto, and with regard to other issues we may need to report to the UN, that is done by a domestic body. In this case, I think it would take more than just Global Affairs Canada's pulling together such a list and making sure we have the proper names and all of the circumstances. It would be bit broader than only Global Affairs Canada—as a tentative understanding of how things are drafted currently.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you, Ms. Keeling.

We will now go to Madame Bendayan.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I also have one more question for Ms. Keeling.

Ms. Keeling, based on the evidence that I have heard so far in the context of this study, I remain deeply concerned about the publication of a list. It would seem to me that the government, as you said, has an obligation to do no harm, and that we could be doing harm by publishing a list. It would also seem to me, notwithstanding the fact that my colleagues have attempted to address that question through the subamendment, that the government does not always have perfect information, and it would be difficult for the government to know whether there are risks to the individual in detention through the publication of their information.

I would like to understand from you—I understand that you may not have a completely definitive answer for me today—if it is possible for the Government of Canada to be liable for any aggravating circumstances, injury to or the death of somebody in detention through the publication of their name.

Is it possible that the government may be held responsible legally for that?

[Jennifer Keeling]

I'm not a lawyer, so I can't comment on the legality piece. I'll restate that the onus falls on the government to ensure that no harm is done by any actions it takes.

I can't comment on the legality. I'm sorry.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Did we want to—

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

Let's vote.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

We'll have a recorded division, please.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

Mr. Chair, on division.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Ms. Ariane Gagné-Frégeau]

All right. We're voting on the subamendment—

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

No.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

I'm sorry. We agreed to adopt the subamendment on division. It's not unanimous, but it's adopted.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

It's either a recorded vote or on division, Mr. Chair. I propose it be on division.

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

We're amenable to on division.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Are we going back to the amendment?

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Yes, as amended.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

I have another subamendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

First we have to approve this, and then we can go to your amendment.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

It was adopted on division.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

We've adopted the subamendment on division, so now we're back to debate on the main amendment.

It may be that Mr. Anandasangaree has another subamendment to propose to the main amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Yes. Is that correct?

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

That's correct. I believe that's been circulated by—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.