Foreign Affairs Committee on Sept. 25th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

I'd like to call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 73 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development.

Before I make a few points, I would like to welcome some new members we have this session. I want to welcome the Honourable Omar Alghabra to the committee. I want to welcome Ms. Sophie Chatel to our committee. Ms. Élisabeth Brière is here on behalf of another member, but welcome nonetheless. It's great to have you today. We have one new member, as I understand, who is someone we've previously had the privilege of working with in this committee. He is now back. That is Mr. Ziad Aboultaif. Welcome, Mr. Aboultaif. I think that takes care of the members.

In addition to that, I'm sure you have all noticed that we do have a new clerk. We're very grateful to have Ms. Danielle Widmer with us for this session. She is a grizzled veteran, if I may say so. It's great to have you here.

In terms of analysts, we are very fortunate that we have the same analysts we've previously had. Mr. Siekierski, B.J., is here today. Ms. Allison Goody remains with our committee. Unfortunately, today she isn't feeling well.

I just thought I would provide those preliminary remarks.

Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the House order of June 23, 2022. Members are attending in person in the room and remotely using the Zoom application.

I would like to make a few comments for the benefit of our witnesses as well as the members.

Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. For those participating by video conference, click on the microphone icon to activate your mike. Please mute yourself when you are not speaking. For those in the room, your mike will be controlled as normal by the proceedings and verification officer. You may speak in the official language of your choice. Interpretation services are available for this meeting.

Although this room is equipped with a powerful audio system, feedback events can occur. These can be extremely harmful to the interpreters and can cause serious injuries. I would ask all members to be mindful of that. The most common cause of sound feedback is an earpiece being worn too close to a microphone. Please do pay attention to that.

I remind everyone that all comments should be addressed through the chair.

For members in the room, if you wish to speak, please raise your hand. For those participating by video conference, please use the “raise hand” function. The clerk and I will manage the speaking order.

In accordance with the committee's routine motion concerning connection tests for witnesses, I have been informed by the clerk that all witnesses appearing virtually have completed the required connection tests in advance of the meeting.

I understand that, as a procedural matter, the first order of business is the election of vice-chairs. I will turn to the clerk to kindly take care of that issue.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Ms. Danielle Widmer]

Pursuant to Standing Order 106(2), the first vice-chair must be a member of the official opposition. I am now prepared to receive motions for the first vice-chair.

[Ziad Aboultaif, Conservative, Edmonton Manning, AB]

I nominate MP Chong for the position of vice-chair.

[The Clerk]

It has been moved by Mr. Aboultaif that Mr. Chong be elected as first vice-chair of the committee.

Are there any further motions? I see none.

Is it the pleasure of the committee to adopt the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Clerk]

I declare the motion carried and Mr. Chong duly elected the first vice-chair of the committee. Congratulations.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

We're good to go on that.

Now we will revert back to our study of the sanctions regime in Canada.

Yes, Mr. Bergeron.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Mr. Chair, events have taken place in Nagorno-Karabakh in recent days and weeks, and, since we've already begun to study the current situation in that region, I would like us to schedule a minimum of two meetings in the coming weeks, if not days, to study what's going on there.

I also have another request. I know we submitted a request to travel to Yerevan and Baku, and, for reasons that escape me still, the official opposition denied that request. I know that the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe Parliamentary Assembly is meeting in Yerevan and that the House authorized travel to that gathering. I also know that the Subcommittee on Committee Budgets of the Liaison Committee sent us a notice indicating that we had to submit our travel requests by a certain date. As such, I'd like us to take a very quick look at the status of this travel request and determine whether it would be appropriate to resubmit it, which would be my preference.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you very much, Mr. Bergeron.

Mr. Oliphant, go ahead.

[Rob Oliphant, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

I was going to suggest—partly because of my need to get caught up on where we are with the sanctions regime study, but also to look at other work—that we have some time for business, either today...because I think, appropriately, Mr. Bergeron's comments would go into a business meeting, as opposed to in this meeting. It's not on the agenda, and I don't believe there's a motion on the floor.

I'm totally in support of a discussion about future work and travel, but I think we need to have it in a business meeting. I don't know whether we have time. Is it respectful to our witnesses today to take 10 minutes out of that, or do we put that first in our next meeting?

I'm happy to take some time out of today's meeting, at the end, to do some business, but I'm also willing to listen to the committee and do it first in the next meeting.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you, Mr. Oliphant.

I will remind the members that we have meetings scheduled for today and for Wednesday, and we have witnesses. The preliminary calendar has been distributed to all the members. Should everyone agree, we can set aside time on Wednesday after hearing from the witnesses to sort through what the priorities of the members are in terms of studies going forward.

Is it agreeable to all the members to set time aside on Wednesday?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Okay.

There's one last thing, and I don't know how everyone feels about this. You will all recall that we have an ongoing study on the situation in Ukraine. It's been a while since we have looked into that study. For the purposes of instructing the clerk, would everyone want us to schedule next Monday—one session—on the situation in Ukraine, or is it the opinion of the members that...?

Go ahead, Mr. Hoback.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

I'm curious, Chair. What were you thinking about witnesses for that meeting? Would we just bring in department officials for a briefing?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

As you know, we now have a new ambassador who has been appointed to Ukraine. If we could hear from the ambassador, that would be very helpful, but in the event the ambassador is not available, for whatever reason, perhaps we'll ask officials to provide us with an update, unless someone has a better suggestion.

Go ahead, Ms. McPherson.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you.

I have just a couple of things. First of all, we have not received a calendar. I don't know if that's just my team, but I have not received a calendar.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

I was under the impression.... I misspoke. I apologize. The clerk says it has not been sent out.

Next, for this coming Wednesday, three witnesses are appearing. Should all the members agree, the second hour would be devoted entirely to committee business.

Does that accord with everyone's plans?

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I'm sorry. I just want to finish my thoughts.

First of all, I think it would be important to have that. We do have a subcommittee, and I do think there is a role for the subcommittee here that is supposed to be helping us as we set our calendar. We do have four studies that we are supposed to be undertaking, including Iran, as well as Israel and Palestine.

More importantly, from my perspective, today we started 15 minutes late. I think we have too much work to do for that to become a habit. We could probably make an effort to start on time. I know that many folks maybe didn't make it in on time, and today is a Monday and a busy day, but when we start 20 minutes late, it's not fair to our witnesses and it's not fair to those of us who are on time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Absolutely. Perhaps I could caution all the members to be here on time. That would be very much appreciated. We certainly do so out of respect for the witnesses, who take the time to share their expertise with us.

Thank you for pointing that out, Ms. McPherson.

So it's agreed that an hour will be set aside on Wednesday for committee business. Is that correct? I understand that the clerk will be sending a schedule for Wednesday.

The clerk has also brought to my attention....

Yes, Mr. Oliphant.

[Rob Oliphant, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

I just wanted to clarify about the meetings. You mentioned next Monday.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

That's what I was about to get to.

[Rob Oliphant, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

Okay. So we're missing two Mondays in a row.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

This Monday is not a holiday, but we don't have a session. Should everyone agree, for the purposes of an update on the situation in Ukraine, that would fall to next Wednesday.

Is that agreeable to everyone?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Yes, Mr. Hoback.