Government Operations Committee on May 4th, 2006

[Raymond Bonin, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Madam Chair, I will speak against that amendment. We are the members of this committee, and there are times when there are issues that are very difficult and complicated. I don't want a war going on behind us between our party staffers bringing expertise when there is a special event. We are the ones who are accountable for the work we do. I don't want us bringing big guns every time there is a controversial issue. It should be one of the employees in our office who is on a permanent basis.

I've chaired a committee where they were bringing the big guns. We broke a record for the longest clause-by-clause. We broke a record for the longest meeting, 28 hours straight. It wasn't us arguing all the time, it was people feeding stuff to the members. So if you want to go through that, let the big guns come in.

It's the same as negotiations with teachers' federations, if you've ever been a trustee. You have your negotiations locally, and when it gets tough for them, they bring in the big guns from Toronto and Ottawa. I personally don't care to have that at this committee.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

Let me just remind you that this is when we're in camera. This is more about in camera. Clause-by-clause is open, normally.

Mr. Wallace.

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

I have just a question to the mover, I guess, or maybe to the clerk. The reading I have of this clause as it's presented here is that it doesn't have to be a staff member from our office. It could be any staff member we choose. If I wanted to bring a Bloc staff member, then technically I could, based on the way it's worded.

I'm not sure there's a need to make the change. I will not have a clue whether the person you bring with you is from your office or from--

[An hon. member]

You will eventually.

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

Yes, I will eventually, I guess.

I'm satisfied with the way it's worded. I don't think the amendment is needed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

Okay.

Mr. Alghabra.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

What if the member himself or herself is unable to make the in camera meeting? Can his or her staff be there?

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

We'd have to change it, because normally, no. It says “accompanied”. It's up to this group. Mind you, your staff would not have any say in what goes on.

Let me tell you something else. If it's an in camera meeting, and if it's an in camera meeting of the subcommittee, that is reported to the full committee. It has to be okayed by the full committee. The subcommittee has the right to make a recommendation but not to have the final say. Anything that's decided by a subcommittee is brought to this committee. Otherwise, we're all here.

I just wanted you to know that.

Yes.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

I certainly understand the concern of Mr. Bonin. I tend to have some sympathy for that position.

I also have another concern. The other concern, of course, is making an intelligent decision with the best information. We all have our various qualifications, capacities, and capabilities, but, as well, we depend on a tremendous number of resources occasionally. I wouldn't want to exclude any of us from having the opportunity to be able to have the most capable assistants here to make a decision, particularly when we're potentially going to be dealing with some very complex matters.

I understand your concern, Mr. Bonin. Were this to turn into a backroom circus, I certainly don't want to go there. I also wanted to have the information necessary that's going to assist us to make the best decisions.

With all respect, Madam Thibault, I certainly understand where you're going with this. I would concur that we should have the possibility of bringing in capable assistants, and there is no disrespect to Mr. Bonin. Our actions will dictate whether we are making the right decision on this, and perhaps we could revisit it if we find that we have a problem.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

Go ahead, please, Mr. Warkentin.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Peace River, AB]

Just for clarification purposes, is it your thought that the way that it reads now would allow us to bring a staff member, even if they weren't from our office?

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

It doesn't specify; it just says a staff member.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Peace River, AB]

As it now stands.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

That's the intent, I think.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Peace River, AB]

Okay, then it would just be a staff member.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

Mr. Bonin, did you move an amendment?

[Raymond Bonin, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

I'll withdraw it if it's okay.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

You'll withdraw it? Okay.

[Raymond Bonin, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

I can live with it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

Madame Thibault?

[Louise Thibault, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

I trust my colleagues. I only have one assistant, and the day when Mr. Dufour will not sit behind Ms. St-Hilaire or myself, I would not want his substitute to be ejected from the meeting. Members have spoken and I trust them. I take for granted that we all understand the motion and that it refers to a staff member from our respective parties.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

The object of the motion is to ensure that staff has the right to be present at in camera meetings.

Mr. Bonin.

[Raymond Bonin, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Madame Chair, just to add to the discussion, I've lived the experience on the aboriginal affairs committee, in which another party brought in someone from outside and put them on their temporary staff. That's why I bring this up. If it's not going to be a problem, we won't worry about it. If it is, we'll worry later on.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

It's a good point, though.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

Has someone moved this motion, by the way, as is?