Government Operations Committee on Sept. 28th, 2016

[Gayle Jones]

Absolutely not, I've had no consultation whatsoever. I had to do the research to find the process. Unless you're an individual who has received mailboxes in your area, it's not easy to even find the process.

[Ramez Ayoub, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

Are you aware that there are those kinds of services? Are you aware of that?

[Gayle Jones]

I'm absolutely aware there are accommodations. What I was going through in my submissions earlier were processes that can seem simple and thorough, but can be very challenging to individuals. I was trying to highlight some of the challenges that these processes have, however well-intentioned, and that more consultation at the beginning of these processes would really help.

The problem that your government has right now is that even today when I told some of my colleagues I was coming here, they said, “What's the point, the decisions have already been made?” It's not your fault, but the fact is that the impression was that decisions were made before, and now that we're doing the consultation—

[Ramez Ayoub, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

We're kind of cleaning up the mess.

[Gayle Jones]

Yes, but you have to deal with the skepticism as an aftermath.

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Brassard, for five minutes.

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ms. John, I want to pick up on something that you brought up in terms of the exception for vulnerable seniors. I know you spoke about seniors. I don't think you quite used the words “fragility, housebound”, but are there any other circumstances other than that? How would you classify vulnerable seniors to receive that exception other than those two that you mentioned there? Are there any other examples?

[Sungee John]

I would also include language barriers as an example because we have a growing number of ethnocultural seniors in Windsor. In the case of our community survey, we found that many seniors came as sponsored parents.

However, the economic downturn over the last few years has made it difficult for the children who sponsored them to keep their jobs here, and those children have moved to other communities while their parents stay here. They're further isolated with the language barrier which makes it difficult for them to access the web, or access other means to understand how their accommodations could be made.

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

We're speaking specifically to exceptions to door-to-door delivery. You said that there are seniors who are vulnerable and in fragile states. Your suggestion is that language should also be included as a part of that exception.

[Sungee John]

Yes.

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

Mr. McNamara, yesterday we had your successor, Lynn Dollin, speak to the committee with respect to the planning process. In your experience as president of AMO, and even your experience as a mayor in dealing with plans of subdivisions, how much communication has there been with Canada Post and municipalities around the province as it relates to these types of mailboxes, both as part of the process of planning a subdivision and as an afterthought?

[Gary McNamara]

In terms of the subdivisions, we plan them, obviously. It's very easy to put the infrastructure in place by keeping—

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

Is Canada Post included in the planning process, though?

[Gary McNamara]

I'll give you a good example. Carmelita Court is a new subdivision. We looked at areas where the infrastructure came after the fact, so we knew going in. We worked with them, mailboxes were provided for the new subdivision that was being built, and then the developer built the infrastructure to sustain it, close to a sidewalk, good lighting, and so forth. They're built to deal with it.

AMO's position during my tenure was to, basically, find suitable alternatives, and if the last, best resource was putting mailboxes in, ensure it was not downloaded to municipalities in terms of infrastructure.

One of the biggest concerns we have in Ontario is joint and several liability. As you know, it's about $250 million a year just to insure Ontario's municipalities. It's because of weak legislation, but that's not your responsibility. It's on the province, and we've been fighting that.

Having said that, obviously, it's easy because you know going in, the developers know, the people moving in know, everybody knows there are community mailboxes that are being built in that area. They're designed and built. There is no question about that.

Would I like door-to-door? Absolutely, but that's not the case.

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

I want to address something that you brought up earlier with respect to transit. Part of the mandate of this committee is to look at the financial sustainability of Canada Post. I was chair of the transportation committee in the city of Barrie. We carried out a complete review of our transit system. I know you spoke in terms of vulnerability, and the service of Canada Post, the service of the transit system.

As the mayor of a municipality, if your transit service—with an understanding that there's only one taxpayer—wasn't performing to the degree or extent that you hoped, would you not go through a review, or would you keep pouring money into that service in order to ensure that it keeps going at whatever cost?

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

Mr. McNamara, I'm afraid I'm going to ask you, in response to that, to give a written submission, just because we're over time. I'll be speaking about that, your opportunity to provide a written submission, when we conclude.

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

I have a quick question, though. I want seven minutes of time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

That's why we want written submissions.

Ms. Ratansi, for five minutes.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Thank you all for coming.

Ms. Jones, I can appreciate your skepticism because the previous Harper government did not believe in consultation. This is a new approach. We are here to consult. We did say in our platform we would consult, so we are here.

Mayor, you talked about the politics. Everybody's blaming Mr. Chopra. Mr. Chopra is a civil servant. He is at the command of whichever government is in power.

Do you think he was politically motivated to take on an agenda? Somebody made the assumption of privatization. Was he given that political agenda because everything Canadian was to be dismantled? Is that your perception?

[Gary McNamara]

Well, let's put it this way, it's a crown corporation. The marching orders still come from the government.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

That's right.

[Gary McNamara]

There's no question that the orders came from them. Let's put it this way, the mailboxes grew in my municipality faster than the dandelions.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

And that came before the election.

[Gary McNamara]

Exactly. There was no consultation. I shouldn't say there was none. They came, they reported they're coming, and it's too bad.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Okay, so this was an edict-down approach. As a mayor, you would never do that because you need to consult your stakeholders, you need to consult everybody.