Government Operations Committee on Aug. 21st, 2024

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

The New York market can be ferocious. It's cooled off a little in recent years, given the circumstances that we've all faced. Your current asking price for the property in question is over $10 million U.S., which puts it in the luxury property category. This type of property can sell very quickly, or it can take 198 days, on average, according to estimates, if the listing price has to be changed.

How long do you hope it will take for the property to sell?

[Stéphane Cousineau]

I thank the member for her question.

I wouldn't want to speculate on how long the property will take to sell. Obviously, it depends on the market. However, I can say that we worked very closely with the real estate agent, who's an expert in the field, on setting a competitive price. You're also aware that we used the services of PSPC to assess the residence and its price. Since this information is confidential, suffice it to say that the two assessments line up.

I'll turn the floor over to Mr. Dubeau in case he wants to add anything.

[Robin Dubeau]

That's a good question. As my colleague said, we don't really have any control over how soon the apartment will sell. However, the New York market is very dynamic, as you said. The realtor has looked at the comparable properties, that means recent sales in the area. He's very motivated and hopeful that the property will sell fairly quickly. Once again, however, it's out of our hands.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Repairs are one of the reasons given for the decision to change apartments. Repairs to the old apartment amounted to $2.6 million in 2021, and apparently they couldn't get done because of the pandemic. However, the apartment recently purchased is located in a new building finished in 2021. I don't see why the apartment couldn't be renovated if apartments were being built at the same time. If you can build, you should be able to renovate.

In 2021, the pandemic was winding down and restrictions were being eased. Are there any reasons besides the pandemic that explain why the apartment couldn't be renovated? Were there other reasons that these major renovations could have been put on the shelf?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm afraid you have not left time for a response.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

You can send it in writing.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Perhaps, Mr. Cousineau, you can commit to putting that in writing for us, or we can get back to it in the next two hours.

Mr. Bachrach, go ahead, please, for two and a half minutes.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Mr. Chair, I think that's an excellent question. Perhaps, on behalf of my colleague Mrs. Vignola, I'll ask why those renovations weren't completed in 2021.

[Stéphane Cousineau]

Indeed, there was an analysis, and the inflation that was happening increased the cost of those renovations. As you recall, there was something particular happening in those times, which was COVID.

I will quickly turn to Robin to articulate what changed and what the challenges were with this renovation that we wanted to do, essentially.

[Robin Dubeau]

Thank you for the opportunity.

There were two elements at play in that file that delayed it. The pandemic, of course, had a tremendous impact on all of our projects abroad. That was one thing. Also, our ability to secure the permits from the various authorities, co-ops and municipalities was taking time, and this led to the delay that brought us to reassessing the renovation and finding out that the costs were escalating, which triggered the full options analysis.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

That's what led to the decision to purchase the new apartment at a different address. Is that correct?

[Robin Dubeau]

Yes.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Okay.

Going up a level to a more general question, I think most Canadians would want us to have representation in New York that is at least on par with our peer countries, given that the United States is our most important trade relationship and shares the longest undefended border in the world.

Could you talk a little bit about how Canada compares with other G7 countries in terms of consular properties in New York? Where do we stack up among that group of countries with regard specifically to the value and location of real estate?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Give us a brief answer, please.

[Stéphane Cousineau]

I've shared one example, which was the U.K., which bought something five years ago, when it hit the media, for $21.5 million.

We've also looked at a couple of other countries to compare with. I would say that we have one of the lowest, if not the lowest, costs of purchase when we compare those relative to other countries. I have New Zealand at $11 million, 11 years ago, so we can imagine the cost today; Italy at $35 million; and even Denmark, which is not a G7 country, at $9 million.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you, sir.

Mr. Brock, go ahead, please, for five minutes.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

The acquisition of this extravagant condo on Billionaires' Row has garnered a lot of attention across this country, including from the media. I'm curious as to the consultations that the four of you have had, prior to today's appearance, with Minister Joly.

[Stéphane Cousineau]

Mr. Chair, we have followed the governance and process according to our delegation of authority—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

That's not the question, sir. I have limited time.

I'm interested in your discussions with Minister Joly in relation to your appearance. Did they happen?

[Stéphane Cousineau]

Mr. Chair, no, there was no interaction with Minister Joly.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Did you receive any emails from Minister Joly with respect to your appearance?

[Stéphane Cousineau]

No, we haven't received any emails—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Has she weighed in on the controversy surrounding the acquisition of this property?

[Stéphane Cousineau]

The minister was not involved in this process.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Thank you.

Was she briefed by you?