Government Operations Committee on May 5th, 2026

[Tamara Jansen, Conservative, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

I totally get that. However, when we asked in December, the answer we received was basically that it's because it fluctuates. I don't understand that answer. That's a silly answer.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

That is our time. I know we have PSPC back on Thursday. Perhaps we can pursue it then.

Mr. Gasparro, we'll finish with you, please.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for being here.

I'd like to go back and pick up where my colleague left off in regard to management consultants. If I understand correctly, only about 1.9% of all federal contract spending last year was on management consulting. Is that correct?

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Yes, that's correct.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

To put that into context, roughly 98.1% of federal contract spending went to other purposes. This is just basic math.

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Absolutely.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Perfect. For those at home who need a calculator, I wanted to make sure.

That would include building and maintenance infrastructure, delivering IT systems, cleaning up contaminated sites, providing health services in remote and northern communities, and other operational necessities. Is that correct?

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

You're making my job easier, Mr. Gasparro.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Perfect. I just want to make sure we're level setting, Minister.

It would be fair to say, then, that the vast majority of federal contracting is not about management consulting but about delivering tangible programs and services to Canadians. Is that correct?

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Again, that's correct.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Are there policies or controls in place to assess whether work should be done in-house versus contracted out before a consulting contract is approved?

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Absolutely.

I think we've developed that reflex in recent years. The fact that this share is quite small, as you pointed out, and represents 1.8% of federal contracts attests to that. However, regarding the decrease in the number of contracts from one year to the next, it's 36% at Public Services and Procurement Canada and 75% at Shared Services Canada.

When we look at all the departments, it's true that the reflex is now to ask whether we have the capacity internally. Sometimes, it may be useful to call on external experts, but the reflex is really to look at our internal capacity.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Great.

How much time do I have, Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

You have two and a half minutes.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I want to clarify one thing my colleague Mr. Patzer said earlier.

The way the law is currently worded, police are unable to issue a warrant for small parcels being delivered. The Canada Post Corporation Act does not allow even for the police to get a warrant to open up someone's mail.

I wanted to correct that for the record. We are changing it, but as of now, not even a police warrant can intercept mail.

As the parliamentary secretary for combatting crime, I just thought it was my obligation.

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

That's a fair point. Police would have to wait until mail is delivered before they can act on a warrant, and that's the issue.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

That's correct, so it puts police officers at risk and puts others at risk. I just wanted to say that.

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

You're making my life even easier now, answering questions better than I did in the past.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I will just finish off on the management consulting and the contracts. Would you agree that the objective is not to eliminate consultants overall, but rather to perform essential services that we do not have in-house expertise with?

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

There are areas in which we will always need outside expertise; we can think of engineering, architecture, construction. For large infrastructure projects, for instance, or decontamination of certain sites, we'll need outside expertise. That's for sure.

However, when it comes to management consultants, we've done a great deal to reduce the use of outside management consultants, and the objective is to build the in-house capacity. Where needed, in some instances.... The objective is to reduce it. The results speak for themselves when you look at what PSPC and Shared Services Canada have achieved.

[Vince Gasparro, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Wonderful. Thank you very much. We actually got caught up.

Minister and officials, thanks for being with us. We are going to excuse you.

Can we do a quick, two-minute turnaround so we can bring in Treasury Board President Ali and get started for the final hour?

We're suspended.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you, everyone, for your patience. We are back.

Welcome back, President of the Treasury Board. We'll allow an opening statement from you for five minutes, please. Go ahead.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, President of the Treasury Board]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm pleased to be here with my officials to discuss the 2026-27 main estimates.

The main estimates outline $502.8 billion in planned spending, including $230.4 billion in proposed voting spending. They include $14.7 billion of initiatives announced in budget 2025.

Mr. Chair, tabling budgets in the fall allows for more spending to be reflected in the main estimates and the departmental plans. This helps align the two documents more closely with the budget. The main estimates include reductions that are part of the comprehensive expenditure review and, importantly, Mr. Chair, they show how the government is investing in key priorities to keep our country strong and prosperous.

Mr. Chair, most of the proposed spending in the 2026-27 main estimates would go towards transfer payments. These transfer payments are vital because they help build a stronger and more resilient Canada. They support important priorities such as benefits for seniors, the Canada health transfer and infrastructure projects. They support national, provincial and territorial programs and provide funding for local communities, indigenous groups, non-profits and research institutions. That's why the government is seeking $300.5 billion in transfer payments, nearly 60% of the total of these estimates.

The main estimates also support activities and investments across the federal government. Less than 30% of the proposed spending, $148.6 billion, would be directed to operating capital expenses. About a third of this amount is focused on securing Canada's sovereignty by rebuilding, rearming and reinvesting in the Canadian Armed Forces. These main estimates include over $48 billion in voted spending to support the Department of National Defence. The investments would support modern equipment, training and co-operation with international partners, helping keep Canadians safe and contributing to global stability. Although Canada has met NATO's 2% defence spending target, our work does not stop here. We will continue investing in the Canadian Armed Forces to ensure that we remain strong, secure and prepared for the future as we build Canada strong.

Lastly, Mr. Chair, my department, the Treasury Board of Canada Secretariat, is seeking $11.8 billion in these main estimates. This will help us meet essential obligations covering public service insurance, addressing rising costs in the public service health care plan, supporting disability insurance programs and accounting for increased payroll taxes.

Mr. Chair, as I mentioned earlier, these estimates also include reductions from the comprehensive expenditure review. This exercise identified savings by eliminating underperforming, duplicated or altered activities, allowing resources to be redirected to higher priorities that strengthen the country.

For TBS, the department is reducing its 2026-27 operating budget by $28.9 million, and annual savings will reach $57.8 million by 2028-29.

Mr. Chair, these estimates show that the government is investing in what matters most to Canadians.

My officials and I would be happy to take your questions.