Evidence of meeting #44 for Health in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was warnings.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Senior Policy Analyst, Canadian Cancer Society
Yes, of course both can be done.
Actually, we are already seeing the federal and provincial governments moving forward. There is progress in that the volume of contraband is on the decrease. Various departments are involved in that.
But the war on contraband is not going to waged by the Department of Health.
Executive Director, Non-Smokers' Rights Association
There's no credible reason the warnings can't come forward while they continue to work on social media, if they believe there is a strategy there that might work. But the fact is, at the moment there is no credible evidence that social media would even come close to replacing the warnings. It simply is not justified.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Joy Smith
Thank you so much, Mr. Mahood.
Now we will go to Ms. Leslie, please.
NDP
Megan Leslie NDP Halifax, NS
Thank you, Madam Chair.
And thank you all for being here and for speaking the truth about this.
You were approached about labelling. You weren't actually told that the labelling project was suspendue, but my question is, have you been approached about social media and its impact on smoking?
I see shaking heads.
Senior Policy Analyst, Canadian Cancer Society
The Canadian Cancer Society has been approached. We operate several smokers help lines, and as a substitute for the quit line number appearing on the package, we've been approached with respect to social media integration.
NDP
Megan Leslie NDP Halifax, NS
Well, that's good. One of you has.
Have you been approached about tackling contraband?
Executive Director, Non-Smokers' Rights Association
I'll let my colleagues address this because this is not my file. But I know that in my organization there have been discussions about contraband.
I must point out that in the six years of consultations that went on over the warnings, social media was never on the agenda. It was never discussed.
NDP
Megan Leslie NDP Halifax, NS
With respect to contraband, have you been given any indications from the government about a rollout for a contraband campaign?
Senior Policy Analyst, Canadian Cancer Society
The government had an announcement on May 28, 2010. Some of those steps that were announced have not yet been implemented.
NDP
Megan Leslie NDP Halifax, NS
Mr. Mahood said that everything is tied to the package. I understand that some tobacco companies have actual departments within their companies that focus on innovation. I think it is a pretty twisted version of the word “innovation”, because I understand that to be innovative means packaging to skirt regulations when it comes to labelling.
You talked about eight-sided packaging. Could you share with us some of the ways the tobacco industry is trying to skirt the rules as they are now? What are some of their innovative strategies when it comes to their packaging? I see you have quite a few samples in front of you.
Executive Director, Non-Smokers' Rights Association
I'll just do a brief introduction. When we go for plain packaging, the most effective packaging, which we will without question encourage, is a shell and slide package, because it has an interior warning system. One of the things they are trying to do, to be frank, is switch the market away from the shell-and-slide package to the flip-top box. The advantage of that, of course, is that the interior warning system is disposable. It can just be discarded. With the interior warning system on this particular package, it is permanent. Every time that package is opened, the 20 times that package is opened, that interior system is there. And it's even more powerful, in some ways, than the exterior warning, because it can be made to be a surprise. A smoker might not like the impotence warning, for example. Males will say that they don't want that one, and they'll reject it at purchase. But they can't reject a message on the inside that they are surprised with. For example, you could put a warning about gangrene on the inside that they might reject if it were on the outside of the package.
What they are trying to do is switch the market away from this packaging to the flip-top boxes. That is just one innovation.
NDP
Megan Leslie NDP Halifax, NS
I've seen quite elegant lipstick cases, almost. I can't even tell what that picture is on the front.
Senior Policy Analyst, Canadian Cancer Society
I have an example of a purse pack super slim cigarette targeted at women. It's outrageous. And it really undermines the impact of the warning. They use the package format or clever designs. In Quebec, Macdonald Special Mild has a fleur-de-lys and in the rest of Canada it has a maple leaf. They are very different emotional appeals, but they take away from the warning.
There are examples of metal packs, a special edition, in Canada. In Germany, they had World Cup soccer feature packs with very nice, big images of soccer fans with national flags painted on their cheeks. They know that the pictures work to promote products. And that's why we're supportive, of course, of having pictures as a means of discouraging smoking.
Senior Policy Analyst, Canadian Cancer Society
They often have their brand name or logo around a cigarette. One country, Singapore, has a tax-paid marking directly on the cigarette to prevent contraband. It is to help identify what is legitimate and what is not. No country has yet required a health warning directly on the cigarette.
NDP
Executive Director, Physicians for a Smoke-Free Canada
Innovations to find a novelty for novelty marketing, which is increasingly part of their marketing, is a significant issue and one that needs a fast government response. One of the proposals made, in fact, to this committee earlier, when they were looking at a prior version of the Consumer Product Safety Act, which exempts, as you know--there's a statutory exemption--tobacco products, was that a de facto moratorium be put on new tobacco products so that we could prevent innovations and market novelties from coming onto the market. Eventually, governments will realize that this is a measure they have to take in addition to standardizing packaging.
NDP
Megan Leslie NDP Halifax, NS
Thank you.
You have all talked about contraband being an aspect. It's not the way to go, but the tobacco industry would lead us to believe that this is going to solve the problem when it comes to smoking-related illness and disease and death. Is this true?
Executive Director, Physicians for a Smoke-Free Canada
I would like to say that what I read in the media about the level of contraband does not fit with what I read from others. There are a number of indicators that show that the contraband problem is getting less and less.... Philip Morris International I don't think misleads its shareholders. It told its shareholders just last month that contraband in Canada was in the same range as in the United Kingdom, France, and Germany, which is between 10% and 20%. The Convenience Store News magazine has boasted about an increase in legal sales. Health Canada's survey of smokers reports that fewer Canadians report going to first nations territories or buying smuggled cigarettes. All the indicators suggest that the contraband problem is getting under control.
Conservative
Conservative
Patricia Davidson Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON
Thanks very much, Madam Chair. I'm going to be sharing my time with Mr. Brown. If I natter on too long, perhaps you can stop me so he has a couple of minutes.
Thanks to our witnesses for being here this afternoon. Certainly you've brought some interesting perspectives to the table, and we appreciate the time you've taken to bring that forward.
I expect that most of you were in the room during the first panel of presentations, although I'm not quite sure. Yes, I see lots of nods there.
I just want to quote from Mr. Paul Glover's presentation. He said, “As you are aware, the Minister of Health has indicated that the department continues to examine the renewal of health warning messages on tobacco packaging.” Then he also says, “Is Health Canada committed to revising the health warning messages? Yes. Absolutely. They are one very important and proven effective mechanism in providing information to help people stop smoking.”
So I think it's been very clear from what the officials have said here today and from what the minister has told us at a previous meeting that this definitely is not an issue that has been put to bed. This is an issue that is very much still under review. Certainly they're working on it.
Some of the questions that came up at the previous panel talked a bit about consultation from the department. A couple of you here today have indicated that—I don't know if they were in working groups specifically—you were working with Health Canada.
Could you confirm that you had been helping out, and to what extent you had been working with them, please?
Mr. Mahood.
