Evidence of meeting #52 for Health in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was foods.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:20 p.m.
Public Affairs Manager, Dietitians of Canada
I have a few on my iPhone, but unfortunately they don't work in Canada. They only work in the U.S.
4:20 p.m.
Conservative
4:20 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Tim Uppal
Thank you.
We'll go into our second round now.
For a five-minute round, please begin, Dr. Dhalla.
March 1st, 2011 / 4:20 p.m.
Liberal
Ruby Dhalla Liberal Brampton—Springdale, ON
Thank you very much for coming before the panel today and providing some interesting information.
Mr. Sherwood, you spoke about Clear on Calories and provided us with some information as well. What kind of reception did you receive from all of your stakeholders with regard to the buy-in to put this together, and how long did it take for your stakeholders, which are the companies themselves, to want to become more transparent and perhaps accountable to the consumer regarding caloric information?
4:20 p.m.
President, Refreshments Canada
It's not as easy as you'd think when you have a diverse group of stakeholders around the table. I think anybody who has been in that process will understand that. I could bore you with five-week conversations on square tablets versus round tablets; however, the buy-in and the reception were almost immediate.
It is an initiative that is also parallelled in the U.S. It was announced by Michelle Obama under her “Let's Move!” campaign. There was quite a prolonged discussion on how to adapt it for the Canadian context, but to give you an indication, the U.S. announced it last February, and they are just now in the field; we announced it this February, and we'll be in the field in May of this year.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
Ruby Dhalla Liberal Brampton—Springdale, ON
Will this be mandatory for every one of your stakeholders that produces--
4:20 p.m.
President, Refreshments Canada
It will be mandatory for all of our members.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
Ruby Dhalla Liberal Brampton—Springdale, ON
What else do you think could have been done? This is an initial stepping stone; what do you think the next steps will be to provide greater information to the consumer?
4:20 p.m.
President, Refreshments Canada
I'm not convinced that a lot of Canadians really know what their caloric requirements are or how to select products to ensure they are not exceeding their caloric requirements on a consistent basis. If we're specifically talking about weight management and obesity, I think there's an opportunity for educating Canadian consumers on what their caloric requirements should be and on how to count calories appropriately.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
Ruby Dhalla Liberal Brampton—Springdale, ON
That goes to my next question. Your written brief states that you are working with the children's advertising initiative to ensure that Refreshments Canada and your members do not advertise to children under the age of 12. Then the next paragraph talks about reducing beverage calories in schools and says that you've voluntarily removed full-calorie soft drinks and are now providing lower-calorie and smaller-portion beverage options to elementary, middle, and secondary schools.
From what I recollect in going into schools on a weekly basis, you see the actual vending machines within the schools, and there are these massive logos that say “Coca-Cola” or promote a particular beverage company. Wouldn't that constitute advertising? How is it that on the one hand you say you're not advertising, and on the other hand--
4:25 p.m.
President, Refreshments Canada
Advertising is paid promotional advertising, whether it's on TV, on the radio, or through those types of media. Vending machines are branded as vending machines. We have not had--and I don't know if we ever would have--that discussion relative to the presence of those particular logos.
I think that's the best answer I have for that one.
4:25 p.m.
Liberal
Ruby Dhalla Liberal Brampton—Springdale, ON
You're saying there haven't been any conversations around taking a look at the actual vending machines themselves to not promote particular soft drinks. More often than not in a vending machine, even if there is water available--
4:25 p.m.
President, Refreshments Canada
There has not been that discussion, and this is the first time someone has brought it up.
I can tell you that under the guidelines we have developed for elementary schools, for water and juice--we don't produce milk--there is a smaller package format for juice, a 250-millilitre size. That's in elementary and middle schools. For upper schools or secondary schools, it is broadened to a range of no- and low-calorie products, water, and juice. There are now provincial regulations that exceed that in a number of jurisdictions; that fact notwithstanding, in the provinces where there are no regulations relative to that, we have gone through and completed our commitment to remove those products.
4:25 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Tim Uppal
Thank you very much, Dr. Dhalla.
We will now go to Mr. Brown.
4:25 p.m.
Conservative
Patrick Brown Conservative Barrie, ON
Thank you, Chairman. We have interesting comments on this topic.
We had a discussion on caffeine levels about a year ago, but it's good to have an opportunity to discuss this issue again. One comment I heard was about lots of young people having energy drinks. I don't think there are a lot of young people having energy drinks. I think everything in moderation is okay.
Ice caps are very popular among high school students. In Barrie, as I drove to some of the recreation centres in the spring, I saw advertisements for ice caps. I don't think Tim Hortons is doing anything wrong in trying to build their market share and I think caffeine in moderation is okay, but I think it would be misrepresentation to suggest more kids are having energy drinks than are having ice caps. I think ice caps are dominating the marketplace, if you look at caffeine intake. I think Parliament needs to be working on much more important things than declaring a war on Tim Hortons or caffeine. I think Canadians enjoy their caffeine and I think there's nothing wrong with having caffeine in moderation.
Justin, how does Canada compare to other countries when it comes to the regulation of soft drinks and caffeine? Does there tend to be more regulation in Canada?
4:25 p.m.
President, Refreshments Canada
Absolutely. Let's focus on soft drinks first, and then I'll come back to energy drinks and caffeine in general.
The amount of caffeine that can be used in a soft drink in Canada is regulated by the Food and Drugs Act and regulations and should not exceed 60 milligrams, I believe, which is the equivalent of a third of what you'd find in an average cup of coffee. Interestingly enough, Health Canada will tell you--and you can look it up on their website--that if you take a look at Canadians' sources of caffeine, 60% comes from coffee, 30% comes from tea, and 10% from all other sources. That's in adults. When you get down into the younger categories, I believe it's 30% from cola and cola-type beverages. It might be slightly higher than that. The point is that you can get those statistics, and caffeine comes from a wide variety of sources.
Again, it's fairly regulated. The Food and Drugs Act and regulations are fairly specific in the application, and recently it was expanded to allow for the use of caffeine in non-cola beverages. To my knowledge, I don't think a non-cola soft drink that is using caffeine has come onto the market in the year since the change. I'm not aware of it.
Energy drinks in Canada are the most highly regulated market for energy drinks. In 160 countries worldwide, they are regulated as food. I think we and the dietitians can agree on one point: we'd like them to be regulated as food too. However, the route to market in Canada has been the Natural Health Products Regulations. The caffeine content is declared on the can in terms of the total quantitative declaration of caffeine from all sources. The formulation, the safety, the efficacy, and all of the other requirements are very onerous in Canada, much more so than in any other country.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Patrick Brown Conservative Barrie, ON
Wasn't there a big study in the EU on energy drinks? What was the result of that?
4:30 p.m.
President, Refreshments Canada
There have been a number of studies of energy drinks worldwide. It's a high-profile category. The EU was asked to consider higher labelling standards similar to what we have in Canada, and they found there was absolutely no need for them and that they were perfectly safe and fine.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Patrick Brown Conservative Barrie, ON
When we're looking at healthy living, I think, obviously, there are a wide variety of things you look at. If you look at high-calorie drinks, I'm just as concerned about the chocolate bars and junk food that are everywhere, so I think it would be unfair to look at only one item. Right now I'm having a Diet Pepsi, and that's certainly not a high-calorie drink. Is this one of your products?
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Patrick Brown Conservative Barrie, ON
I'll do my best. I intend to have one at every committee meeting.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
4:30 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Malo Bloc Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC
Mr. Chair, let me continue along the same lines as my previous comments.
We hear that using identical servings in order to compare products could be accomplished quite rapidly. I asked Mr. Sherwood if that kind of thing was possible in his industry. He nodded, meaning that it is in fact possible.
However, from the answer he gave to Ms. Dhalla, it seems that things are perhaps a bit more complicated. Many negotiations have taken place and many emails have been exchanged. It has taken a lot of time to achieve anything. I see that Refreshments Canada has given itself until the end of 2013, almost three years, to standardize the labeling on all its products. Don't you find that three years is a long time to apply a little logo that indicates the number of calories in a bottle?
