Evidence of meeting #45 for Health in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was point.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
Thank you, Chair.
Mr. Stewart, in answer to my colleague Mr. Davies' questions you said that you were referring to the usual sources to get information regarding whether or not you would be complying with the House order. Who are the usual sources?
President, Public Health Agency of Canada
As I mentioned, it's the Department of Justice.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
That's great.
When my colleague Mr. Davies raised a matter, you suggested that you were looking for immunity. Do you want to expound on what you meant by immunity?
President, Public Health Agency of Canada
Mr. Chair and honourable member, what I was trying to do was disentangle. I have to abide by the law.
Conservative
President, Public Health Agency of Canada
Mr. Chair and honourable member, the acts of Parliament that I'm following were passed by the House and the rest of Parliament. They have the full force of law. I have to act in a way that is consistent with them.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
Mr. Stewart, you do realize that an order of Parliament is also lawful. Is that correct?
President, Public Health Agency of Canada
Mr. Chair and honourable member, you are parliamentarians and know better than I do whether the House of Commons is equivalent to the totality of Parliament. My understanding is that an act of law is passed by the Commons as well as the Senate, etc., through a process than involves more than a motion, but I am not an expert in that area. You may know more than I do.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
Thank you.
Through you, Chair, Mr. Stewart, as Mr. Davies mentioned, the order requires the production of documents for the law clerk for redaction. Do you believe that the law clerk is not sufficiently equipped to redact the documents?
President, Public Health Agency of Canada
Mr. Chair and honourable member, in order to make a determination about whom classified material can be handed to, normally we look at the levels of protection around the material before we transfer it. That would be my response.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
You do believe, then, that the law clerk is not sufficiently able to redact documents via an order of Parliament.
President, Public Health Agency of Canada
Mr. Chair and honourable member, if you look at the motion and the previous motions, you will see no guarantees in any of the wording that the materials provided will be managed in a way that's consistent with the security required given their level of classification, so I have no information on that front, actually. I can't answer your question.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
It is, Mr. Stewart, within your opinion that the Speaker was wrong in ruling a prima facie case of privilege.
President, Public Health Agency of Canada
Mr. Chair and honourable member, you've asked me several times for an opinion about the Speaker's opinion. This is not an area in which I am an expert. I have tried to avoid even appearing to have such an opinion, so I would say, as I have previously, that I don't have an opinion about that.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
Thank you, Chair.
I will now pass the floor over to my colleague Mr. d'Entremont.
Conservative
Chris d'Entremont Conservative West Nova, NS
Thanks.
Let's go back to some of the questions Monsieur Lemire was asking the minister about the PMPRB.
From what I understand from your answers, the regulation changes will happen on July 1. Is that correct?
Liberal
Patty Hajdu Liberal Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON
We're still reviewing the PMPRB. As you know, it's been delayed twice because of, obviously, the state of a pandemic and the incredible focus of the pharmaceutical industry on responding to the pandemic. Right now we're assessing the next steps on the PMPRB.
Conservative
Chris d'Entremont Conservative West Nova, NS
How are those assessments taking place? Is there a little consultation going on or people writing in? How are you doing that?
Liberal
Patty Hajdu Liberal Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON
We're doing that in a variety of different ways, including speaking with the industry and other stakeholders.
Conservative
Chris d'Entremont Conservative West Nova, NS
Has there been considered within it of some of those recommendations that have been provided by patient groups?
Monsieur Lemire just spoke to a number of those requests—changing the basket of countries, particularly taking out the U.S. and Switzerland, which I believe were the two that were creating a challenge; trying to find a way to implement the regulations over a longer period; and then trying to find a way to actually have true consultations between PMPRB and the patient groups.
Liberal
Patty Hajdu Liberal Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON
Actually, those consultations have been ongoing and regular. In fact, I've met with a number of patient groups and with a number of other stakeholders, including industry stakeholders and Innovative Medicines Canada. Those are ongoing conversations that I would say my office and I have on a regular basis.
Conservative
Chris d'Entremont Conservative West Nova, NS
In those discussions with the patient groups, did you apologize a little bit for the work PMPRB did, especially when it came to certain patient groups, on trying to find a way to make them seem to be bought out by the pharmaceutical companies?
Liberal
Patty Hajdu Liberal Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON
The conversations I've had with the patient groups have been extremely respectful from both sides. I would say that the patient groups have understood that the government, at the end of the day, is trying to make the very expensive medications in some cases for their particular illness group more affordable for their families. For example, we know that Trikafta has just received approval here in Canada. The real challenge now is the affordability of that drug.
Patient groups fully understand that the government is trying to do a number of things. One, obviously, is to reduce the costs of drugs, especially those high-cost drugs. They appreciate the work we're doing as well on the rare disease strategy, because of course many of those patient groups are not just advocating for access. They're advocating for affordability. They understand that this is a complex landscape and that we will continue to meet with them on a regular basis. We have never shied away from meeting with any patient group.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ron McKinnon
Thank you, Mr. d'Entremont.
Ms. Sidhu, go ahead, please, for five minutes.