Evidence of meeting #44 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 3rd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was believe.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
Well, just in view of what Ms. Ratansi was saying, I believe....
This is for clarification, I think, as much as anything, but I'd like some verification from you, Mr. Ullyatt. Did you not testify when you first appeared before us that the reason you sent these reports out to lobbyists was to try to curry favour with them? You were looking for perhaps a job with a lobbying firm. Is that not correct?
As an Individual
No. I believe my original answer to that question was that I was trying to make myself look important. The inference, because I also happened to be looking for employment--
As an Individual
--in numerous places as well as with the individuals I sent it to, was that I was doing it to curry favour. I actually do not.... If that were the case, why did I not send it to everybody I was looking for a job with in government relations? No, these people were on the top of my mind when I was committing an act that is unacceptable, and I was simply trying to make myself look more important.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
The reason you sent it to just these select lobbyists is that you had personal relationships with them? You still testify you did not send it to anyone else?
As an Individual
That is correct. The list of lobbyists that have been questioned by this committee are the only people I sent the document to. I believe my last testimony said.... The question was asked why these five, and I can only come up with the answer I came up with last time, which was simply because they were on the top of my mind at the time.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Joe Preston
Thank you.
Madame DeBellefeuille, you have a quick, one-minute one-off?
Bloc
Claude DeBellefeuille Bloc Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC
Mr. Ullyatt, I'm trying to understand your motives. In your first testimony, you said you had sent the draft report to your friends without expecting a response. In fact, your friends proved to be lobbyists who were in a good position to forward your CV, particularly Ms. Hamilton, with whom—as we can read—you shared a very deep friendship and had a very privileged relationship.
Did you inform Ms. Block that you had privileged ties with lobbyist friends?
Did you have cerebral paralysis or what?
As an Individual
No. I believe if there was ever a request made for Mrs. Block to see somebody and it was from somebody that I knew, I disclosed the fact that I knew this person and that it made no difference to me whether or not Mrs. Block would take a meeting with them or not. My friendship had a boundary on professionalism.
Bloc
Claude DeBellefeuille Bloc Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC
In your view, as a parliamentary assistant, it wasn't important to tell your boss that you had privileged contact with lobbyists or to offer to have her meet them, if she wished? You concealed the fact from Ms. Block? She wasn't at all aware of your privileged relations with the firms to which you sent the draft report?
As an Individual
No. I'm sorry, I'm not sure if my last answer was misunderstood. That's exactly what I said. I disclosed to Mrs. Block if there was a request from one of my friends to her. If they were looking for a meeting or looking for her to review materials, I would disclose to her that, yes, this person is a friend of mine, and it matters not one bit to me if you take the meeting or if you read the document. They are a friend and that's all. The friendship stops at the door.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Joe Preston
Thank you.
I think we've gone through three rounds now, and I think we should just call it a day on Mr. Ullyatt's testimony.
I thank you for coming today, and thank you for sharing with us. I thank the members of the committee for being on topic today and staying with the gathering of information.
Mr. Ullyatt, you are excused.
I will suspend for a couple of minutes while we bring in our next guests.
[Proceedings continue in camera]