Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Nov. 5th, 2013

[Nycole Turmel, NDP, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I also have a young student with me; his name is Camil. I hope that he appreciated this morning's presentation and that it was of some help to him.

I would like to follow-up from the previous meeting, where we discussed at length the matter of meeting in camera. We decided that it was up to Conservative members to make a motion to form a sub-committee, or a working committee, to determine the requirements for meeting in camera.

I have a motion; there are copies here. It is similar to the last one, except that the first paragraph is different. I will read it to you.

That the Committee include in their review of the Standing Orders a full study on when a committee may conduct their business in camera and use the following guidelines:

I will not list them here, but they are the same as the ones I listed before.

The last paragraph reads as follows:

That all votes taken in camera be recorded in the Minutes of Proceedings, including how each member voted when recorded votes are requested.

That would give the working committee some direction and would allow us to determine the needs for in camera work.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Thank you.

I was not at the last meeting, so I'll turn it over to the chair of that.... No, I'm just kidding.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

I was not here, so I don't know where we stand on this motion.

We have a motion on the floor, but we also have committee business we must deal with.

I leave it to the committee as to where we're going here, folks.

Mr. Julian, very quickly, because we're all going to run out of time at one o'clock.

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I think this is a motion that goes in the exact sense the Conservatives mentioned when Madam Turmel presented her original motion, so I think we just need a sign from the Conservatives that they're going to vote for this, and we'll be governed subsequently. It certainly responds to what Conservatives mentioned, so I think Madam Turmel has done wonderful work.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

I have Mr. Lukiwski on this, and then I'd like to bring it to a conclusion.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Very briefly, Mr. Chair, the position of the government has not changed. I stated at the last meeting that I believe committees have to have the ability to go in camera when they wish not be constricted by the finite terms as presented by the NDP.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Mr. Julian on that.

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

There's no contradiction here, Mr. Chair. I believe Mr. Lukiwski now has a copy of the motion that was revised following the comments from the Conservatives. This isn't an issue that's divisive. This is an issue on which everybody around the table should be in agreement.

There's a whole range of areas where we could go in camera, including on any issue at all where the committee has full agreement, so there's no problem. It's not rocket science. It responds to the Conservatives' concerns that were expressed publicly, and it certainly I think responds to the concerns that Madam O'Brien and Mr. Watters raised about public disclosure as well. This gives the Conservatives exactly what they wanted, exactly what they asked for. I would assume this would mean that the Conservatives would say yes to this.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Seeing nobody else on my speakers list, I'll call for a vote on it, then.

Mr. Scott, you're in favour?

[Craig Scott, NDP, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

No. My hand was sort of up and you didn't see me.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Okay.

Let's get on the list quickly if we're going to talk about it. We have only a couple of minutes left.

[Craig Scott, NDP, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

I'll be very quick.

I just wanted to follow up on what Mr. Julian was saying and make sure that my colleagues across the way understand that the motion is for a full study on this. It is not the same motion you saw the last time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

This committee will at some point study the Standing Orders.

Does anybody else want to speak to this motion?

Mr. Lamoureux.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

I have just a bit of concern now, after what Mr. Scott has raised. Can I get a copy of exactly what it is we're voting on?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Sure. I thought it was distributed.

I'm very sorry, Mr. Lamoureux. I thought you had it.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

No—but I do now.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Your speed-reading is coming into play at this moment.

Seeing no one else on my speaking list, Mr. Lamoureux, do you have further thoughts?

I know you're getting there. I saw your lips were still moving—no offence.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

No, I'm fine, Mr. Chair, if you want to call the question.

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

Mr. Chair, I'd like to request a recorded public vote on this.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Certainly.

(Motion negatived: nays 6; yeas 5)

That has failed, so we'll move on to committee business very quickly.

Your steering committee met yesterday. We are working on planning the rest of the study on the Board of Internal Economy. It's been left with your clerk and your chair to put together the rest of the schedule.

We have the requests from all members on what witnesses would be there. Some have already been asked. Some have not. Some have already moved their time around. So you'll have to bear with us; we will give you full committees of....

I need to know from you all....

Yes, Mr. MacKenzie?

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

Should we not be in camera for this committee report?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

That's likely right. It is a committee report, so I suppose we should pause for 30 seconds to go in camera.

I forgot that. Thank you. Your chair apologizes.

[Proceedings continue in camera]