Evidence of meeting #126 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was agreed.
A recording is available from Parliament.
6:10 p.m.
LCdr Jean-François Morin
It would remove that requirement, but a following motion, which is associated as per the chair's ruling, LIB-60, would empower the commissioner of Canada elections, in the course of an investigation conducted in response to a complaint, to request documents from registered parties in support of their election expense returns.
6:15 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Through you, Chair, this removes it here and adds it through LIB-60, you said?
6:15 p.m.
LCdr Jean-François Morin
Yes.
6:15 p.m.
NDP
6:15 p.m.
LCdr Jean-François Morin
It's just different.
6:15 p.m.
LCdr Jean-François Morin
The Chief Electoral Officer of Canada does not conduct investigations. The Chief Electoral Officer conducts audits of the various financial returns that are provided to him. On the other hand, the commissioner of Canada elections conducts investigations on the enforcement of the act.
6:15 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I don't want to get into a policy debate, but why not both? Why take the power away from the commissioner, even if it's being found over with the investigative body, because I don't see anyone opposed to the audit by the commissioner of how a party conducts itself and how it spends money.
I'd be curious. Maybe Mr. Bittle has a reason.
6:15 p.m.
LCdr Jean-François Morin
At this point, it's a policy decision.
6:15 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
That's a policy decision.
Through you, Chair, to Mr. Bittle, why remove that power from the commissioner, because they do audits and that seems appropriate to me?
6:15 p.m.
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
They do audits. Before political parties submit their election returns anyway, they are audited in advance, but if we're dealing with millions of dollars in receipts, finding the receipt from the Tim Hortons perhaps provides too much of a burden. However, giving that over if there is an investigation, allowing the commissioner to require the production of that material is still within the bill and provides a more balanced approach.
6:15 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Okay, that was a bunch of words. I'm trying to find out what—
6:15 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
No, but the commissioner doesn't ask for every Tim Hortons receipt in this case, right? This is where the commissioner has the power to request specific receipts. They're not going to ask for every cup of coffee that was bought during the campaign, and they don't. Why remove the power? If, worst case, it's redundant, and you have two offices with that power....
I don't know if Elections Canada has a comment that could help guide me through the fog.
6:15 p.m.
Senior Counsel, Legal Services, Elections Canada
We should distinguish between Elections Canada, which performs—
6:15 p.m.
Senior Counsel, Legal Services, Elections Canada
—the Chief Electoral Officer, which performs the audit power. Currently, as was recommended by the Chief Electoral Officer, there's the power in the bill for Elections Canada to request supporting documents in the course of the audit to find out what lies behind the expenses that are reported. This—
6:15 p.m.
Senior Counsel, Legal Services, Elections Canada
—would remove that power. It gives the commissioner power to more easily obtain documents that they could obtain during an investigation.
This does not meet the suggestion of Elections Canada, in our recommendation—
6:15 p.m.
NDP
6:15 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Elections Canada never came to the committee and said, “Please take this power away from us.”
6:15 p.m.
Senior Counsel, Legal Services, Elections Canada
It was our recommendation that we should have a power much as is in the bill right now, yes.
6:15 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
So in fact the opposite is true. Elections Canada came before this committee and said they must maintain this power. In your testimony, you had a concern about removing this section.