Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Dec. 11th, 2018

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Yes.

[Stéphan Aubé]

The governance for the approval and the review of different scenarios such as that has not been put in place yet. Right now, as we said, we're working at the initial stage to understand the facility.

One of the mandates the Speaker has given us is to put forward some recommendations in terms of establishing a governance model by which we will make these types of decisions. This governance will certainly be engaging the members in terms of both the requirements and recommendations from a cost perspective. These recommendations will also be vetted by the experts so that we can come with recommendations to parliamentarians by leveraging expertise, either from this team or exterior to this team, but this would be vetted through a governance that would be approved by the members and certainly the Board of Internal Economy of the House, and also the Senate.

That model hasn't been established yet, Mr. Reid. We're looking at putting something in place. It's a priority for Mr. Wright and I to come up with a model and some recommendations for the Speaker in early January so that we can move forward with it.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

We will be in a position, then, when the House resumes at the end of January, to approach our own Speaker and inquire as to where he's headed on it.

[Stéphan Aubé]

Hopefully we'll have a draft to him by that time, sir, and something could be put in place quickly so that we can move forward. That's the goal, sir.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

I'm glad you're including the Board of Internal Economy and this committee, of course—procedures for the House—and then the appropriate bodies in the Senate, as well.

I assume someone has already passed on one of the many inputs that will come from this committee—it's in the minutes of our meeting from last year—which was to look at a potential space for children, either in the courtyard or in or near this particular building.

We have five minutes to vote, so we'd better go.

There's coffee at the back. Chat with the people in the room. We'll be back as soon as the House of Commons allows us.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Welcome back everyone to the 138th meeting of the committee on the Centre Block renovation.

Thanks, Mr. Reid, for the gift to all committee members—Filibuster IPA. Thank you very much.

Mr. Aubé is ready to answer the last question, maybe.

[Stéphan Aubé]

We just wanted to make sure that we answered the question on governance, because everyone went to the vote after that.

Is there any follow-up on that? Is everyone okay?

[John Nater, Conservative, Perth—Wellington, ON]

I might have a follow-up in my turn.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

We'll go to Mr. Graham, Mr. Nater and then Ms. Lapointe.

You got on the list first.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

I have a question for all of you. Have any of you ever served as an MP or senator?

Have any of you ever worked on the Hill as a staffer of any sort within the precinct? None?

Who is approving the space requirements and allocations for both the Commons and Senate sides of the building? Who makes those decisions?

[Susan Kulba]

Typically we work with the whip's office for space allocation based on the policy that was approved at the board.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Who makes the final call?

[Susan Kulba]

For the space allocation...?

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

For everything, whenever a decision is made somewhere in this building, who makes that final call?

[Susan Kulba]

The Board of Internal Economy is our highest level of approval.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Do they approve all the details, or do they have a grander scheme and you are left to some discretion?

[Susan Kulba]

Yes.

When we come to the end of a key milestone, we go to the Board of Internal Economy with a higher-level overview. The staff work on a lot of the detail. We'll share that up to various levels of authority. Sometimes it's the Clerk or sometimes the Speaker, depending on how much detail they actually want to be engaged in.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Who would make the decision on the size of offices, for example—the allocation, floors and surface area?

Would it be the Board of Internal Economy, the Speaker, the Clerk or a staffer?

[Susan Kulba]

The current requirements that we use for MP offices were established in the late 1990s. They were approved at the Board of Internal Economy. That has been a standard we've applied in every new renovation to date—the 90 square metres.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

You're talking about the individual offices. I'm talking about the overall offices.

I want to make sure that we don't come up with administrative buildings. I want to make sure that this is our functional members' offices buildings.

Who allocates how much goes to the clerks, to members, to administration, to parking and to the locksmiths? Who does those allocations?

[Susan Kulba]

When it comes to members, those requirements were established in “Building the Future” and approved at the board level.

How many units—MP units, they're called—are allocated to an MP, a minister, a leader of the party, etc., were established as a baseline. That's what we have tried to follow where possible. Sometimes the building doesn't always allow for that. We negotiate a compromise if required.

When it comes to the rest of the space allocation within the building, that essentially is approved at the Clerk's level.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Does the same thing apply on the Senate side?

[Susan Kulba]

I believe so, but I couldn't speak for them. I'm sorry.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

The building is a joint jurisdiction between the Commons and the Senate, so who would speak to the Senate side of this building on this project?