Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Feb. 4th, 2016

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

When you started, where did you see your career going? Was helping to guide this country the type of thing you'd hoped to do as you built your career up?

[Huguette Labelle]

I started my life in Health Canada and moved on to Indian and Northern Affairs in the Government of Canada. I was able to discover the rest of Canada, discover our country and its people, to a greater extent than what I had known before. Basically, this was an impetus to stay as a public servant for as long as I did. When I left, I could have stayed as a deputy minister, but I had had 19 years in that position, and I felt it was time to leave the space to others and also to give back to the country and to the international community.

You will see that most of what I have done is voluntary. It has not been paid work, and that's fine. That was part of the decision. It also meant that it gave me an opportunity to see our country in a very broad way, through the departments I was responsible for. Before being a deputy minister, I was in Health Canada and in Indian Affairs and Northern Development, and I did a lot volunteer work both outside the country and in Canada.

It was a personal choice, but I felt there were many other Canadians who were also doing the same thing. I think all avenues can contribute to our country, whether you're in business, a member of Parliament, or in a non-governmental organization.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

I have 20 seconds left.

I note that in your plethora of honorary degrees, you have some that are not from Canada. I was wondering if you had some time to address your international experience, but I think we're out of time. Just tell us a bit more about what you did outside the country.

[Huguette Labelle]

About countries—

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

What you did outside Canada. We'll have to come back to that later.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

No, I'm sorry. You'll have to answer that later.

Mr. Reid, you have a five-minute round.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My question follows on Mr. Christopherson's questions about how, given your previous role in Transparency International, you would treat confidential and secret information, and it follows on Mr. Graham's question on how your experience as a public servant would cause you to treat confidential information.

The nomination forms for senators, filled out by organizations in the phase 1 process, are Protected B once completed. Do you regard this as meaning that you would be unable to reveal not only the content but also the name of the nominating organization for a person who's applied to the Senate, and has been accepted by the Prime Minister, and then placed in the Senate? Would the information regarding who the nominating agency was be something that would itself be protected and be information you would be unable to reveal ex post facto?

[Huguette Labelle]

I think there would not be any problem in revealing the names of the organizations that have been consulted as widely as possible. I think if we linked the name with the candidate, then we would get into the privacy issue, because one would have to deal with the name of the individual.

This is one of the things that our committee will need to work at as soon as this first phase is completed and we prepare our report. We will need to work at how to best include what we should include in our report. As I said before, we are consulting very widely at this time. The wider the better, because it makes it possible for more outstanding people to be identified.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

I am only referring to the phase 1 process, in which I assume you're not actually consulting. I could be wrong here, but I'm assuming you're not consulting and that you have to wait for organizations to send nominations to you. That doesn't really create a capacity to reach out. I'm not talking about what happens after phase 1. Am I correct that in phase 1 you have to simply wait for the nominations and applications to be submitted to you, and then see if you have two that match up?

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Ms. Sahota.

[Ruby Sahota, Liberal, Brampton North, ON]

On a point of order, I think we've been quite fair. There have been a lot of lines of questioning about process, and this one is completely and utterly about process. It is not tied into Ms. Labelle's qualifications or experience at all.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Ms. Labelle, do you have any comments on your qualifications in dealing with protected information?

[Huguette Labelle]

I guess I need to go back to my time in the Privy Council and as a deputy minister. We had to respect the laws we have but also respect the individuals. In that context, private information is private and needs to be protected, based on the legislation we now have.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Based on your experience dealing with issues of conflict of interest, how would you determine whether or not someone has effectively had to solicit an organization to support them or has been chosen by an organization because that organization believes this is the person who will best represent that organization's interests in the Senate, a problem that clearly would violate the constitutional injunction that senators be independent? How would you deal with that concern?

[Huguette Labelle]

If you look at our website, you will see that the applications do not come only from organizations; there is also a need for three separate reference letters in relation to the candidate. That broadens, I think, the extent of what the individual can bring, and brings us more information in looking at the credentials of the individual. The organization makes the recommendation, but at the same time letters of reference are part of the process.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

You have 50 seconds, Mr. Reid.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Thank you.

I'm not sure I understood that. Are you saying that you can go back to the individual and say, “Please submit additional information; what you submitted in your application form piques our interest, but it's insufficient for us and we require further information”, or does it all have to be submitted at one shot by noon on February 15?

I'm asking about the phase 1 process.

[Huguette Labelle]

Sure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

You don't have to answer process questions, but answer what you want.

[Huguette Labelle]

Again, Mr. Chair, the information may not all come at the same time, as long as it is in by the deadline that has been provided. You can get the recommendation, you can get the letter, but then you can get the letters of reference afterward. It doesn't all have to come together in one package, as long as it is completed by the time that's been set.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Thank you.

Mr. Chan.

[Arnold Chan, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I just want to clarify how much time I have. I do note that the clock is past 12 o'clock.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

We started late, so you have a five-minute round. Hopefully we can get to Mr. Christopherson.

[Arnold Chan, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Great. Thank you. I appreciate that, Mr. Chair.

I want to echo my colleagues on the government side in terms of first thanking you for appearing before this committee on such short notice. We are all duly impressed by the incredible.... I mean, I couldn't even get past the first paragraph before I started asking myself, “What have I done with my life?”

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