Procedure and House Affairs Committee on April 21st, 2020

[Charles Robert]

Mr. Brassard, in addition, I think we should be taking this experience as the first step in a larger program of determining how we might want to build the capacity in our parliamentary system to allow for such things as virtual sittings to deal with circumstances that may arise unexpectedly, where the use of a virtual sitting would be appropriate.

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

I thank you both.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Thank you to both of you.

Next up is MP Gerretsen, please.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Because I'm in a five-minute round, I'm going to jump right into it. My questions are related to not particularly the 338 MPs but all the staff who support us. The reality of the situation is that whatever decision we make in terms of bringing people together, at least the 338 of us were part of that decision-making process. Whatever comes out of this, we are imposing upon other people out there, who really don't have a say, whether they're going to continue to social distance in some form or another, or outright abandon it, in order to be present on the Hill.

Therefore, Mr. Speaker, first, can you clarify who is responsible for an employee on the Hill? I have two employees who work for me in my Hill office. Are they employees of Parliament or are they employees of a member of Parliament specifically, and whose responsibility is it to ensure their safety?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

It is the responsibility of the individual members of Parliament to make sure that their staff are safe.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Then, in effect, I am the employer of my employees as it relates to responsibility.

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Exactly.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Outside of this virtual setting, do you have a sense as to how many employees would be on the Hill at any given time when we're normally sitting?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

I'll have to defer to the Clerk on that one. I'm not sure.

Do we have a number?

[Charles Robert]

My guess is that it's roughly 1,000 employees. In normal circumstances, there are about 1,000 employees. There are 338 members, and in most instances they have more than one employee.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Okay.

Regarding direction, I know the Speaker indicated this earlier on, maybe through a question he was asked, but is staff being directed to do something on the Hill—that is, directed not to come to the Hill? Can the House administration direct these staff who are the employees of members of Parliament not to come to the Hill if they wanted to, or is it up to the member of Parliament to do that?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

We've laid out guidelines for certain buildings that are not essential, and we've asked members of Parliament to not have their staff come in unless they come in through appointments or make sure that they're covered, just to make sure that everything is sanitary. We found that there were some MPs who had some staff coming in, and they would come in for a few hours and it was spotty. We didn't know where they were. We were trying to keep records and then send in cleaning staff to make sure that everything was sanitized, once they were done, to avoid the spread of the virus.

What ended up happening was that we asked that certain buildings be shut down and that Centre Block and only essential buildings be open, Centre Block being an essential building.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

I'm talking specifically about staff of members of Parliament, but can you tell us what the direction has been in terms of any other parliamentary staff? Have they been told to stay home? Have they been told to work at home where possible?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Where possible, staff are instructed to work from home. There are staff members who have to come in because it is essential that they be on the Hill. Among the prime groups are security staff and cleaning staff and some of the top administration. Lately, with some of the work that's being done on the technical side, there are people on the IT end of things as well.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Mr. Speaker, with House administration, you're responsible for the staff who work in West Block and on the Hill, correct?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Yes, that's correct.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

As their employer, given the information that you have and what has come forward from Health Canada and the various different agencies, if 338 people and all of their staff started showing up in that building from various different places across the country, would you be concerned about their health and safety?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

I would have to be, yes. When people from all over come to one place, yes, they're bringing we don't know what, whether it's picked up on the plane or from their own place of residence. Yes, it certainly is a concern that has to be taken into consideration.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, Mr. Gerretsen.

Mr. Speaker, are you okay for taking one more question?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Certainly.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Thank you.

Actually, it might be two more.

Go ahead, Mr. Duncan.

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

No problem.

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, for being here today.

I wanted to focus on another aspect we haven't really touched on too much, which is voting and what that might look like.

I appreciated your opening comments alluding to the difference or perhaps the relative ease in doing members' S. O. 31 statements and questions in question period versus voting. Can I have some of your preliminary thoughts? You were coming to talk about phasing some things in. Could I have some general comments about your thoughts or concerns, or the challenges you see, with regard to voting and what voting may look like at the onset, and get some timelines on that?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Voting is something that I don't see happening in the near future. That's something that requires some technology that personally I'm not yet comfortable with. What we'd have to do is develop a secure system that guarantees that everyone can vote and everyone can vote securely.

What I do have a concern about, when you have a few speaking for others, is parliamentary privilege. We've seen it in other parliaments around the world, where there's almost a proportional system whereby one party will vote a certain way and the party has a representative who represents all of their members, and that's—