Evidence of meeting #41 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was election.
A video is available from Parliament.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bardish Chagger
Welcome to the second hour of our meeting of the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs.
I would like to welcome our Chief Electoral Officer, Monsieur Stéphane Perrault, to PROC again.
Thank you for always taking the time. With that, I will pass the floor over to you.
Stéphane Perrault Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Since my November 1 appearance, I have read news reports of foreign interference in the 2019 election. I am not in a position to speak to the accuracy of the contents of the recent news articles, but what I can say is this.
First, there were concerns prior to the 2019 election regarding the risks of foreign interference through various means. This is why, as part of a range of actions in preparing for the 2019 election, national security agencies took part in a meeting of the advisory committee of political parties, under the auspices of Elections Canada, to raise awareness regarding possible attempts by foreign state actors to interfere in the election. As I said in my last appearance, election security is a team sport.
Second, there are clear protocols in place among national security agencies, Elections Canada, the Commissioner of Canada Elections and other law enforcement agencies to allow for the sharing of information based on respective mandates.
The Canada Elections Act very clearly prohibits foreign contributions to candidates. According to the protocols in place, if there is information that would assist the investigation of illegal contributions, it should be sent to the commissioner.
I will note, however, as I did previously, that interference by foreign states raises issues that go well beyond compliance with legislative provisions and involve state-to-state relations.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I welcome your questions.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bardish Chagger
Thank you very much for your comments.
We will move to the first round of questions, where each member will have six minutes.
Before we begin, I remind you that all comments should be addressed through the chair.
Mr. Cooper, you have the floor.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
Thank you very much, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Perrault. It's good to see you again before our committee.
You referenced in your testimony the Global News report. In the November 7 report and in an updated November 20 report, Global News stated that intelligence memos cautioned the Prime Minister and several cabinet ministers regarding a vast campaign of interference by Beijing in the 2019 federal election campaign.
Has the Prime Minister or anyone in his office reported to Elections Canada any particulars concerning a campaign of interference by Beijing?
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
I'm not aware of any specifics regarding campaigns of interference by Beijing other than what I've read in the news article.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
So, the answer to my question is that no report has been made by the Prime Minister or anyone in his office.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
Madam Chair, that is what I said. I would like to remind the committee that the mandate of the commissioner of Canada Elections, unlike my own mandate, is to investigate cases of non-compliance. If there is evidence to support an investigation regarding an offence under the Canada Elections Act, that information should go to the commissioner of Canada Elections.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
Just to be clear, no report has been made from the Prime Minister to you or to the commissioner, or anyone in your office—
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
Certainly not to my office or to me. I can't speak for the commissioner.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
Can you undertake to find out from the commissioner?
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
I think it's for her to speak to the committee, Madam Chair. If the committee wants to ask, perhaps by written means....
I would note that the commissioner's independence is something that is very important, and that was very much a subject of legislation in recent years. There is a very clear distinction from her mandates—
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
Well, perhaps we do need to hear from the commissioner, just as we had both you and her on November 1.
Similarly, can you confirm whether any reports to Elections Canada have been made by any cabinet ministers or any officials in their office?
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
I've not received any reports regarding specific instances of non-compliance with the legislation or specific instances of Chinese interference in the election.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
You're not aware that the commissioner has, from any minister.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
I'm not aware that the commissioner has. I'm aware that we....
As we prepare for the election, we have extensive discussions with partners. We do tabletop exercises at the different levels of each organization—DG, ADM, deputy minister—so that people understand the roles and responsibilities and are able to share information.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
Yes. Thank you, commissioner.
I take it that no investigation has been initiated.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
I can't speak to that. I have no way of speaking to that. The law is very clear about the role and the commissioner's limitations in sharing information.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
So you can't speak to that.
Perhaps you may be able to elaborate on answers provided by the commissioner to our committee that I received, that committee members received, yesterday. As you will recall, on November 1 the commissioner referenced that in the 2019 general election, there were 10 separate allegations of foreign interference brought to the attention of Elections Canada. She went on to indicate that there were 158 complaints.
I'm wondering if you could answer whether any of those 10 separate allegations of foreign interference concerned the CCP.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
I'm not in a position to speak to that. Again, the work of the commissioner is done independently and in confidence.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
You're not able to speak to any particulars concerning those allegations.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
You're not able to shed any light to this committee on—
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
That is correct. I can speak about roles and responsibilities—