Human Resources Committee on Oct. 26th, 2006

[Joyce Reynolds]

Yes, I would agree with that. Immigration isn't going to be the whole solution, but it's certainly a part of the solution.

Right now, the vast majority of positions within our industry are barred from this country based on the point system. Although we do have recent immigrants who work in our industry, they are unemployed engineers, doctors, teachers, and those sorts of individuals who are—

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Who should be in their professions, right?

[Joyce Reynolds]

They've come in and they've quickly become disillusioned with our country because they're not able to get jobs where they want to get jobs.

In terms of the temporary foreign worker program, our members are saying that the people they're bringing in under that program want to stay, but they're forced out again. That's why we're emphasizing recognizing Canadian work experience as part of the point system. These people who come in on temporary work permits can then be evaluated based on their work history while in Canada, so that they don't have to go back to their other country and then reapply to get into this country again.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

My thought is that with demographics the way they are in terms of an aging population, and fewer people having fewer babies, then with the exception of immigration, I don't see how we can deal with this issue at all. So if you say that's only part of the question....

And I'm not talking about certain aspects of immigration. I'm not talking about the temporary workers or the undocumented workers. But what is the solution if it isn't immigration? What are we going to do?

[Joyce Reynolds]

Absolutely. It has to be part of the solution, and we have to bring people in who are going to have families here and are going to have young kids who are going to be able to grow up and work in all of our industries.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

True.

[Joyce Reynolds]

But we also have to look at all of those who are unemployed in our country and find out how to get them into the workforce. Quite frankly, for some of those people who are regularly unemployed, we have to find a way to be able to match them with jobs in those periods when they're on unemployment. They can go back to their hotel jobs later, but they will actually have employment during the other parts of the year.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

David, did you want to make another comment on this?

[David Wassmansdorf]

There is a term that we hear from time to time, and it is “Canadians first”. We'll hear that from some parts of the labour market, but I think we have to get past that notion of Canadians first.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

But to Mr. D'Amours' point and to Ms. Reynolds' point, I think the challenge is that you must advertise through a labour market study and displace people who would like to stay in the region when we could instead go straight to the fact that we don't have the bodies and we need to bring people in. If that's just one example, I can understand the frustration of individuals who are saying we need to cut right to the fact that we need to get the bodies here, as opposed to spending dollars and all this other time advertising for something we know is just not going to happen.

[David Wassmansdorf]

For sure.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Mr. Maynard, do you have...?

[Kevin Maynard]

I just have one point to make. I believe it relates to the issue we're talking about, that being the use of transferrable skills, the recognition of essential skills in the workplace, and how those skills could be used as the model for allowing an individual to move from one occupation or sector to a job in another occupation or sector. It's not by recognition of the job, but by recognition of the essential skills and the competencies that person has, and how those competencies and skills can be applied to other work.

In our sector, that's one of the things we'd like to focus on, because there are many new occupations in our sector. People aren't aware of the occupations, but they do have essential skills that can be applied to the jobs.

Some of the work that has been done through HRCC in the identification of essential skills through the NOC codes may help to accomplish some of that movement of the person's job, not necessarily the person.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you.

We're going to move to the second round, beginning with Mr. D'Amours, for five minutes.

[Jean-Claude D'Amours, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I would like to go back to the subject I spoke about earlier. I'm going to submit figures to you and to ask for your comments. As a matter of fact, this applies to all of you.

Ms. Reynolds, you spoke about individuals who receive EI regularly. They become unemployed because of the season, and not because they feel like receiving EI benefits. I'm going to give you an example. The Canadian Nursery Trades Association appeared before us this morning. The president and the CEO told us they tried to combine their Summer working season with the Winter season of another industry. Now, the other industry needs the workers before the end of the Summer season. In the same way, when the Winter season ends in the other industry, the nursery and horticultural season has already begun. Those people try to make the system work but they haven't found yet with which industries they could match in order to cover the 12 months of the year without any overlap.

Did you know that in Quebec, 55 percent of businesses are concerned about a skilled labour shortage? Across the country, it is in the Maritimes that the unemployment rate is the highest. Did you know that 48 percent of P.E.I. entrepreneurs foresaw that this would be a problem in the long term? We are talking about 43 percent of New Brunswick entrepreneurs. Did you know that over the next 12 months, in the Maritime provinces, we would need to increase by 67 percent the number of full-time employees? Did you know that in the Maritimes, thus in New Brunswick, in Nova Scotia and in P.E.I., the estimated total of long term vacancies was 12 percent, namely the totality of Canadian needs? Now, we represent, I think, 5 percent of the Canadian population.

I would say that, for your industry, the construction industry, or for any other industry you are representing here, the solution lies maybe elsewhere. Other areas are going through the same thing. In fact, everybody has the same problem. Maybe we should accept to use immigration directly if the are no candidates.

[Joyce Reynolds]

I fully agree.

[Jean-Claude D'Amours, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Workers are told to stop working at the age of 65. Now, maybe we should ensure that they can continue to work after that age. You will understand that your first recommendation hurt me.

I simply want to emphasize that some people have the same problem, therefore it is not an issue which is specific to one area or one industry.

[Joyce Reynolds]

I don't disagree with you at all.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

I think Mr. D'Amour would like to recommend that the first recommendation get bumped back on the list.

[Joyce Reynolds]

That's just one of many recommendations.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

We'll make that number eight, okay?

[Jean-Claude D'Amours, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

We face other challenges. We need to find a common way to keep our employees in one part of Canada. We will do our best to find another way to bring employees to those parts that need more employees, but not without....

In French, we say: «Il ne faut pas déshabiller Pierre pour habiller Paul».

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

I think we say that in English too. Don't rob Peter to pay Paul. I like that.

Thank you, Mr. D'Amours.

Madame Bonsant.

[France Bonsant, Bloc, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

I'll follow up on Mr. D'Amours' comments.

Conservatives are convinced that we need to find other jobs for seasonal workers. I would like one of you to tell me if he would be prepared to include, for three months a year only, one seasonal worker in his or her industry.

My neighbour, for example, drives trucks which carry asphalt during the Summer. He doesn't work between December and mid-March. Would you be prepared to hire him for three months a year so that he can continue to work in another place during the nine other months?

[Joyce Reynolds]

In my industry, absolutely.