Human Resources Committee on March 27th, 2007

[Gary Merasty, Liberal, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Over the last few months we've had a lot of discussion on employability, which is what we're studying. One thing that strikes me as a common thread is that we are, of course, going to be facing a major labour shortage. The Canadian Teachers' Federation, which didn't appear as a witness, is talking about 50% of their teachers being eligible to retire in the next five years. For nurses, I think you said, it will be 40% or 50% fairly soon.

To me, one of the problems we've had, or the biggest barrier--and you've referred to this, Ms. Silas--is the stovepiping of departments, the not talking to each other horizontally. Then you have the added barrier of provincial and federal.

It would seem to me that we are at a crisis point here, and I think that's what we've heard. Seniors, foreign workers, aboriginal people, women, and recognizing the abilities of those who are disabled to increase their participation in the workforce--these are all things we need to address.

We were talking about the summer student program. This program, if properly designed, is definitely one tool. Whether it's private or public--and yes, maybe some of the private can afford to do some on their own--something needs to be done, because the shortages are everywhere.

My question in that context--and this is a very loaded question--is this: if you had a top wish list of one or two priorities that you'd like to see to increase the labour force in your particular area or profession, what would it be?

I'll ask Mr. Davis or Ms. Silas, for starters.

[Kurt Davis]

I think our first priority would be to have additional resources to expedite the prior learning assessment process. There's no question that it's very burdensome. We can't afford to charge what it would truly cost, because it would be too much of a burden on the recipients. Our members are paying a big piece of the bill. If we were to charge what it truly costs, it would be more than triple, probably, what we're currently receiving.

The other key thing would be to ensure that we continue the dialogue to keep all those pieces of the public coordinated. We need a made-in-Canada solution. We need an internationally educated health professional solution. We need, especially in our profession, to focus on the aboriginal community, because we have an identified deficiency.

We have to also realize, at least within the health professions, that there is a global shortage of workers, and if it doesn't get its act together, Canada is a sitting duck for the big sucking sound from the U.S.A. With their situation in our profession, they could absorb our whole workforce tomorrow. We have to address this.

We already have provincial pilfering going on. That's happening now. Despite all the rules and all the rhetoric, it's happening. We have to make sure that we're not shooting ourselves in the foot, and we need to get our act together.

[Linda Silas]

I would just add that I think the solution is quite simple. It's like any employer. You need to create a stable workforce, a stable environment for employment, and we have to have a balanced approach.

We're talking to our nurses and other health care workers. You need to start thinking of working past the age of 55. It's not the golden age. Our workforce is changing, and we should change the work area. As Mr. Lake was mentioning, they want part-time work. Why? Because they want the flexibility. They have families, or if they're close to retirement, they want to do something else. We have to show flexibility, and we have to show family benefits and look at child care.

[Kurt Davis]

To add to that, though, with the restructuring of how pensions are calculated, for many health care workers it's the last three years of your working life that is the basis for your future pension. We need to look at changing that so that those workers can continue on in part-time, reduced hours.

My wife is 55. She's going to be a grandma next August. She doesn't want to be working the weekends, the shifts, the nights, the whole nine yards, as she did when she was 20.

[Linda Silas]

You're going to be a grandpa too.

[Kurt Davis]

Yes, I'm afraid so.

[Gary Merasty, Liberal, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

Is there any more time left?

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

You have a couple of seconds.

[Gary Merasty, Liberal, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

That's okay, then.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Just to wrap up, to finish up, I do have a couple of questions.

Mr. Davis, you talked about a bridging program, which I'm assuming is industry driven or sponsored by your particular field for what you guys do, as an example. I have two questions. Can you talk a bit more about what that is exactly; and then secondly, you talked earlier about trying to get some help for the industry, so is this the type of thing you're talking about, to get support for these types of programs?

Then I would throw it out to any of the other organizations as to whether they have a bridging type of program.

[Kurt Davis]

There are basically two different configurations of bridging programs. The one type, I would say, is familiarization with the practice and the profession, and basically an exam preparation type of course. The other type of program that exists in Canada for our profession is more focused on a true examination of the gaps and deficiencies of the individual. They use the prior learning assessment that we do as a basis for evaluating what the candidate needs or what gaps they need to fill.

If they have too many gaps, they can't do it through a bridging program; they have to go back to school. They are offered in community colleges. There are two in Ontario, one in B.C., and there was one in Alberta for one session.

At this point, they have received some funding through HRSDC as pilot projects. However, it's the ongoing funding. They are offered for a couple of years, and then all of a sudden they're cut loose on their own and they have to be self-funding. Again, it's this whole issue of cost to the new immigrant. They cost more to offer—I've heard, between $8,000 and $10,000. A new immigrant doesn't have that to pay.

So there needs to be some different funding mechanisms for ongoing support of them. That's a key thing for the future.

The one other consideration we have is the resource within our office to facilitate the work that needs to be done on prior learning assessment, the funding to assist us. We've developed the mechanisms. We have them working. We could make them go faster if we had some additional resources.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you.

Ms. Silas.

[Linda Silas]

In health care, there are very few for immigrants per se, but there is a program for aboriginals, the aboriginal workforce participation initiative out of HRSDC, and we need to look at that and expand it. That's another way of giving local employers just that little boost of funding to help them integrate aboriginals into a training program to bring them into full-time employment, and I think the same analysis could be done for any immigrants coming into health care.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Ms. Bose.

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

I have just two comments. One is to remind the committee that 85% of the Canadian labour force is in non-regulated industries or professions. Therefore, immigrants coming in, and I myself, could belong to a non-regulated profession, but a guild, controlled by a guild, whatever that means.

Secondly, what would really help is a soft loan facility by the provinces, by the feds, a loan facility that people could access on a revolving basis in order to upgrade. This is something we would very much like to see.

All our recommendations are in the brief. Thank you so much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

I want to thank the witnesses for being here today. We appreciate your input into helping us here at this employability study. Thank you, and have a great day.

To the remaining three or four members who are here, could you look at your outlines so that we can discuss them for Thursday's meeting, to give direction to the clerk on where we're going to head with this employability study.

The meeting is adjourned.