Evidence of meeting #45 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 40th Parliament, 3rd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was family.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Candice Bergen
Thank you.
I have a follow-up question, if it's okay with you, Mr. Martin. There are a couple of minutes left.
You alluded to a basic human right to have a forever family. We've talked about this in committee, the basic human rights for shelter and food, but I don't think we've really ever heard that. We know it, but we haven't heard it articulated that way.
I wonder if one of you could comment on that. I mean, foster parents provide you with food and shelter, but I think we're hearing about this basic human right to have a forever family. Maybe that's where, if I'm hearing you, we have neglected to help guarantee that.
Would you say that's something we've forgotten about in government?
As an Individual
I think that's absolutely true. We have signed on to the Convention on the Rights of the Child, and that is something that's national; it does guarantee certain rights to children.
Again, somebody else mentioned this idea of taking family for granted. I think sometimes it's so easy to forget, when so many people do have families, what we would give to have some of those family spats and quarrels that people talk about as normal.
That's the thing. We don't even have the right to have what's normal, what everybody else takes for granted. Maybe that's why it is abandoned as a right to have that sense of belonging and somebody to go to.
I do feel you articulated that well. It is something that has not been really addressed by government, that it is a basic right.
Food and shelter are wonderful, but you can get that in jail too. You can get that through begging. You can get that just about anywhere. However, children don't get the ability to choose certain things. That's where it takes people, such as you, who do have the power to make sure that when we don't have the choice, we're protected, that we have somebody looking out for us.
I do believe that is our government's responsibility.
February 17th, 2011 / 11:40 a.m.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you to our witnesses for appearing, for your compelling testimony, and your courage as well. I've only ever talked about the fact that I'm adopted. I've never really talked about the circumstances of my adoption publicly before, so I appreciate that you have come and laid an awful lot out on the table.
My own experience is I was adopted as an infant, so I didn't have to navigate, if you will, the child welfare system. So I don't have the experiences that some of you do. Notwithstanding that, adoption is still difficult. I could say that turning 40 next month, I'm still in counselling for issues that stem back to my adoption and other things like that—although I can say I'm making progress too, so there's hope. I appreciate that you've been able to share that.
I probably have about two hours' worth of questions. I will try to do what I can in a short period of time here.
Not having an experience with the child welfare system, maybe you can answer just a few basic things for me. Is there much contact or connection with others, your peers, in the child welfare system? With a foster placement, are you sort of isolated from the experiences of others?
Just briefly, if you can.
As an Individual
I will speak on that.
I worked at the Children's Aid Society for about a year. I think Lisa does right now. When you are in foster care, there are supports within the child welfare system. At the Children's Aid Society of Ottawa there is a program known as CAST. It is Children's Aid Society Teams, and youth can come together to support one another within the foster families on the struggles they are going through with group homes, etc.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
That is something they can come together for, but other than that, once you're in placement, you're not necessarily connected to the experiences of others in the child welfare system. Is that fair?
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
Let me go on to the next question, then.
From your experience, can you tell me, in your opinion, whether the child welfare system in Canada is in crisis? We have heard others say that. By your experience—and it could be a simple yes or no.
As an Individual
I can say that it depends upon what province you're in. Again, it's one of those things for which there is no national—
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
Who is way ahead on that and who is not? Who is setting the gold standard?
As an Individual
It's hard to say because it depends on.... For instance, in Ontario we have 52 or 51 agencies.
Lisa Davies
Fifty-three. And each of them has its own board of directors, and each of them answers to a set of standards; however, they operate in different ways. Not to show too much bias, but I do believe Ottawa is ahead of the curve on a lot of things as a city agency, but again, there is no real standard across the country, and I do feel that it is something that is in crisis.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
What incentives or services are terminated once you age out of the system? What are you losing, if you will, in terms of support once you leave the system?
If you can, be as brief as possible on that.
As an Individual
If you've been attending school, you can have support until 21, but I don't know how many here would have finished a degree by the time they were 21. So all of a sudden you are left to hang and left alone, with debt piling up and so on. I know a lot of people pile up debt, but when you've gone through a lot of psychological issues in your young years, it's hard to keep a handle on trying to maintain your education and maintain all the things in your life that you need to do to get ahead to where you need to be to be a productive member of our society.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
There are a number of jurisdictions, even within Ontario. We said there are 53 Children's Aid Societies. But across Canada, more broadly speaking, there are a number of systems that deal with child welfare and adoption.
If I hear correctly, are you agreeing with witnesses who have come before that there should be some cross-Canada focus, if you will, to address the child welfare system crisis? That we adopt a national adoption strategy by the federal government and provincial, territorial, and other partners, with a focus on moving children from the system to adoption permanency? Am I hearing that there is agreement from you that we should be doing that?
I see heads nodding.
As an Individual
Absolutely. I think there should be a national strategy. Again, every child should have the same rights, no matter what province they're in.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
Can you identify current barriers to adoption right now? I know you mentioned the issue of international adoption, but are there other barriers to children being adopted from the child welfare system? Can you identify some of those for us?
As an Individual
I think, again, there's just not enough focus on the fact that permanency is important. Too often we rely on that foster care system to take care of our children and youth, when there should be a focus that adoption works, that adoption is the better solution because it gives those attachments throughout adult life that the foster care system can't give you when you're being parented by a system.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
I have about a minute left, they tell me, and I have two questions. I'll put them out there.
First, for those of you who have been adopted, what supports are needed post-adoption, from your perspective?
Second, also for those on the panel today who are adopted, what challenges did your adoptive caregivers face? I say that with respect to the need for some sort of leave for employment insurance, but I presume it's going to have to be based on the challenges they face. Not the care issues with the children, but what types of things have they gone through? Are there difficulties attaching as parents? Are there psychological issues they go through—sleep deprivation, things like that? What can you tell me about that?
As an Individual
Since I had so much trauma in my eight years before I got adopted...I'm trying to say it correctly. I think parents need a lot of support after, because I gave her so much hell, I guess. I still do, but I know—
Conservative
As an Individual
I know kids who have always been with their parents still give them hell, but I was testing boundaries because I didn't know if she would leave me. I didn't know if she would put me back. I only had a certain amount of time with her at home, plus I was at school. I would like to have had more time with her, because I needed more time to get close to her, to trust her, because so many people lied to me; so many people didn't say what they were going to do. So I still have those troubles with her, but I would have liked more time with her, and more time for people to help me being adopted, because I was just adopted, and I felt like I didn't have the support that I needed.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Candice Bergen
That is all of Mr. Watson's time, but if anybody else wanted to add anything, I think we'd be.... Do you mind if...?
We'll let Jon finish. We have a little bit of time. We're going to try.
Go ahead.
