Evidence of meeting #103 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was students.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Bobby Morrissey Liberal Egmont, PE
I want to hear your answer, and then I'd be interested in Patrick's answer.
Executive Director, University of Victoria, Co-operative Education Program and Career Services
Generally, trends that I have seen are that we have seen a general growth of work-integrated learning programs across the country, so an expansion of different types and an expansion in the number and range of programming. As has been mentioned previously, you'd be hard pressed to not find institutions that have work-integrated learning in a range of different academic disciplines, so it's really not just in the STEM subjects anymore. There is a growth in—
Executive Director, University of Victoria, Co-operative Education Program and Career Services
There has been a growth in that, an expansion of the breadth of the kinds of programming.
There's been a growth in the interest in international, both in terms of students going out and international students coming in. All of our institutions have experienced growth in the number of international students on our campuses, and those students are very interested in having work-integrated learning experiences in Canada and elsewhere.
The national average for students studying abroad, according to the Canadian Bureau for International Education, is about 2.5% to 3%. It's about three times that rate for students doing international work-integrated learning because of the connection to career development in an international context and the development of global skills.
In my institution, we're seeing a growth in the engagement of indigenous students in our programming. We're seeing that in some instances, but I wouldn't say it's across the board.
Director, Skills and Immigration Policy, Canadian Chamber of Commerce
We could identify a number of different trends. If you look, for example, at the discussion around things like the skills gap that employers are citing, I think you've seen a fairly significant change in the nature of that conversation over the last 10 years. Previously you'd hear more of a focus on the lack of particular technical skills, for instance, whereas now I think there's a broader conversation about the demand for a wider range of more professional skills, more adaptability skills. We're starting to see a conversation around things like more general attributes, having a growth mindset, professionalism, resilience, those kinds of things. I think you have seen a change in what people are looking to get out of working and creative learning experiences.
There's certainly a higher appreciation for them across the board. I think more businesses are aware of them, and they're participating in them, although there are still limits on how many are capable. There's a broad agreement that they are increasingly an important part.
Furthermore, you're seeing the participating students coming in with a lot more awareness of the challenges in the job market. I think there's an awareness they are coming into a more competitive market. There's an increase in the acknowledgement that learning isn't a one-time thing, that it's lifelong. You can identify a number of trends that have been increasingly important over time. It depends on which particular example. It's all part of an ongoing conversation lately.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bryan May
That's excellent.
Thank you very much.
Now we'll move to MP Warawa, please.
Conservative
Mark Warawa Conservative Langley—Aldergrove, BC
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you to the witnesses.
Dr. McRae, you highlighted that a new curriculum and experience is critical to the changing needs within the workplace.
My responsibility in this Parliament is to represent Canadian seniors, and right now there are more seniors than there are youth. One in six Canadians is a senior, and within 12 to 13 years it's going to be one in four. There's this major demographic shift within Canada. That brings challenges, but also opportunities. There are opportunities for youth to be involved in geriatrics and home care, huge opportunities for good high-quality jobs. You can advance through different levels of geriatric care and even palliative care positions.
My question has to do with this year's budget. The government acknowledged the aging population, and said that as Canada's population continues to age we need to prepare for the challenges that seniors, especially senior women, face. That's because women live longer. That's why budget 2018 proposes to provide $75 million through the Public Health Agency of Canada to support the healthy seniors pilot project.
Dr. McRae, would you see Victoria, western Canada, as a good location to be considered for a pilot project on how to take care of seniors better? The government has budgeted these dollars and the question is, where would they be best spent? Could you do a one-minute presentation on why Victoria would be a great place to have a pilot project?
Executive Director, University of Victoria, Co-operative Education Program and Career Services
Of course it would be a great place; it's Victoria, after all. Isn't that the city of the newly wed and the nearly dead? Isn't that the joke about Victoria—present company excluded, of course.
Executive Director, University of Victoria, Co-operative Education Program and Career Services
I'm sure I could connect you with the people involved at the centre on aging. It's a very significant research centre at the University of Victoria, dealing specifically with these issues on health and wellness for our aging population, and how we can do a better job of meeting this grey tidal wave, I think they call it, so we can have the supports in place and a good quality of life for our seniors. As you rightly pointed out, there are all sorts of interesting work opportunities and future careers for individuals interested in geriatric care and the importance of a quality of life for our seniors.
In a one-minute pitch, I think Victoria is a lovely place for that kind of thing, a natural location for it, and we do have a centre on aging that could provide the research chops to support that kind of pilot.
Conservative
Mark Warawa Conservative Langley—Aldergrove, BC
Thank you, Dr. McRae.
I have a question for Mr. Snider with the Chamber of Commerce.
My background is in small business. I've been a member of the chamber for almost 30 years. Even as a member of Parliament, I support our local chamber and really appreciate that it remains non-partisan yet represents small business in a very necessary way. It also provides advice to small businesses on how they can connect and provide youth and the next generation with the experience they need.
There was a comment on the budget that came from the president and CEO of the Canadian Chamber of Commerce, Perrin Beatty. He said:
Canadian business asked the government to focus on fundamentals like the growing competitiveness gap, the need to attract more private sector investment and presenting a realistic plan to balance the government’s books.
He went on to say:
The United States is undertaking the most massive tax and regulatory update in generations. Meanwhile, Canadian governments are moving in the opposite direction by increasing costs and adding to the regulatory burden. We urgently need [the] federal [government's] leadership to close that competitiveness gap to prevent the loss of billions of dollars of investment from Canada.
The chamber is also disappointed in the lack of a concrete and responsible plan to balance the budget, and the unrealistic economic expectations it laid out. Mr. Beatty said:
By adding a further $18.1 billion to the national debt..., the government appears to believe that we can spend our way to prosperity. If Ottawa continues to run up the debt when times are good, we can only speculate on what our national finances will look like next time there is a downturn.
How is this going to affect the future? We have that burden of increasing debt and that lack of competitiveness, and our number one competition is global now, with the Internet and people shopping online. As we become less competitive, what happens to the jobs? Are there more jobs or fewer jobs, or is it static?
Director, Skills and Immigration Policy, Canadian Chamber of Commerce
The statement largely speaks for itself. The chamber's position is very clear that the key in regard to the government's treatment of business needs to be emphasizing competitiveness. We need to make sure there's long-term fiscal stability, and that in the long run we are able to continue to have a competitive economy compared to our trading partners and the competition around the world. In that sense we'd expect, based on a lot of the long-term estimates, that there might be a negative outcome if we continue with the issues that were identified in that statement.
That's a little outside of my personal area of expertise. I'd direct you to some of the other policy directors at the chamber for a more detailed explanation, but that is a fairly self-evident statement.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bryan May
Thank you very much.
Back over to MP Morrissey, who barely got enough time.
Liberal
Bobby Morrissey Liberal Egmont, PE
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
To follow up on the comments by my colleague, I would just say that the previous government never balanced the books, ran a $150-billion deficit, and created a fake surplus going into an election. They previous government did that on the backs of seniors, I might add, who he was speaking to. Our funding program focuses on social programs to enhance programs such as this particular one.
Putting that aside, I would like to go back to Ms. Fannon to comment on the trend. I was interested, because that really adds some substance to the study we're doing.
Past President, Co-operative Education and Work-Integrated Learning Canada
Absolutely. Just to follow on the comments made by our colleague from the Canadian Chamber of Commerce, this notion that there are fewer and fewer direct paths to employment is one that we're really seeing. It doesn't mean our Canadian graduates are not employable, and it doesn't mean they can't find paths into high-quality, high-paying positions, but it means those paths are much more convoluted than they were in the past.
Again, one of the many benefits of work-integrated learning is that opportunity to explore a multitude of careers. A co-op student could have between four and six four-month paid work terms working for different organizations in different industries. They can work for a non-profit, or they can work for a corporation, and so on, and they can really find where their passion is.
When our students who exceed and excel in co-op speak to that, that's exactly what they say, “Co-op allowed me to find my passion.” They find an organization that fits with them when they're young, and then they start to morph and grow and develop with that organization. We're really seeing this idea of the development of transferable skills and many paths, but less direct paths, to employment.
Director, Innovation Policy, Mitacs
If I could add one thing to the trends that have already been mentioned, something that we are definitely seeing is an increased interest in entrepreneurship from young people coming through our PSE institutions.
We are also seeing that students who have undertaken a research internship with Mitacs are coming out of those, and sometimes very unexpectedly, with an interest in starting their own business. Now that they've had some of this real-world experience, they think, “Wait a second, I have this great idea,” or, “I've done this research and I have something that I think is commercializable. Maybe I can eventually start a company.”
We are starting to see that as a path or an outcome into the labour market that maybe has grown over the last several years.
Director, Waterloo Centre for the Advancement of Co-operative Education, University of Waterloo
I would say, to follow up on Gail's comment, that's exactly the trend we've seen at Waterloo with respect to entrepreneurship.
We've been talking about ways to better support students in the academic programming, but we've also designed programs such that students can, during their work term, work with a mentor and develop their business idea as their co-op work term.
I had a conversation once with a graduating student who was about to embark on his new company as he graduated. I said, “What's the connection here? Help me understand why we have so many students who go on to start their own company. What is the connection with co-op?” His comment was that to successfully start your own company, you need some experience in business, and by providing that experience through work terms during their 18-year-old to typically 23-year-old range they're then ready to launch right at the age of 24 sometimes, which is before they maybe get caught up in the rest of life and they have to take less risk with respect to what their career is going to look like.
I thought that was a really interesting potential for why the value of this early work-integrated learning might connect to an increase in entrepreneurship.
Liberal
Ramesh Sangha Liberal Brampton Centre, ON
I'm going with the same question. Have you found out why that interest is there to get into entrepreneurship?
Director, Waterloo Centre for the Advancement of Co-operative Education, University of Waterloo
I think there are quite a number of reasons, and that it's a research project waiting to happen, but one is Waterloo attracts it based on the reputation of the institution. I think that exposing students to problems in the workplace, where they have the opportunity to see what's happening and they come up with ideas of problems they could solve, is one.
I think exposing them to peer groups who are thinking about the same kinds of things as they work through the courses is also a contributing factor to it.
Conservative
Rosemarie Falk Conservative Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you for being here today.
Typically, students would apply for co-op programs. Is that correct? How are they advertised? Are they advertised just online or—
President-Elect, Co-operative Education and Work-Integrated Learning Canada
If I could speak to that question, there are different models of co-operative education programs that different institutions offer. For example, at Conestoga College, my institution, some of our programs are mandatory co-op, meaning when a student applies to that particular academic program, they must successfully complete those co-op work terms in order to complete the credential.
Other programs are what we coin optional co-op programs. That means they might enter in a non co-op stream, and then at some point they apply, and often, based on academic performance, if they are eligible they enter a co-op stream, and then they participate in co-op work terms in that co-op stream.
Conservative
Rosemarie Falk Conservative Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK
If a student enters a co-op program, they would for sure have placement, so to say.