Evidence of meeting #16 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was asked.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Charles Sinclair  Attorney, As an Individual
Pura Velasco  Member, Caregivers Support Services
Magdalene Gordo  Member, Caregivers Support Services
Richelyn Tongson  Member, Caregivers Support Services

9:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

I'm going to call the meeting to order, ladies and gentlemen.

This is the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration, meeting 16, Tuesday, May 12, 2009. The orders of the day, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), are for a study of ghost consultants and migrant workers.

We have, by way of video conference, the first set of witnesses, who are the Caregivers Support Services. Members of the committee, there are three members of this group: Pura Velasco, Magdalene Gordo, and Richelyn Tongson, who are before us today to give testimony. Also present with these members is the group's counsel, Charles Sinclair.

Mr. Sinclair, I want to make quite clear to you the process of standing committees in this place. That is, that you have the right to advise your clients, but you do not have the right to ask questions, answer questions, or indeed make statements. Your only right is to advise your clients, which you have the right to do.

Are you clear about that, Mr. Sinclair?

9:05 a.m.

Charles Sinclair Attorney, As an Individual

We understand that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

9:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Thank you, Mr. Sinclair.

It is also customary that we allow groups up to ten minutes to make an opening statement before members of the committee ask questions. You can ask questions on either of the topics that are before us, which are the subjects of ghost consultants and migrant workers.

Is there anyone there who wants to make an opening statement on behalf of the Caregivers Support Services?

9:05 a.m.

Attorney, As an Individual

Charles Sinclair

Mr. Chair, just so that we're clear, you said ten minutes. Is that a total of ten minutes for all three?

9:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

That's up to ten minutes for all three, yes.

9:05 a.m.

Attorney, As an Individual

Charles Sinclair

Okay.

Mr. Chair, Ms. Velasco is going to start with a statement.

9:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Thank you very much. The clock is running.

9:05 a.m.

Pura Velasco Member, Caregivers Support Services

Good morning to the members of the standing committee on immigration and employment.

The time is very short, but we have submitted to you our brief in the previous days, so I'll maybe just focus on what we would like to tell you.

9:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

I'm sorry to interrupt you. I don't think we have that brief, just so you're aware of that.

9:05 a.m.

Member, Caregivers Support Services

Pura Velasco

I submitted a brief.

9:05 a.m.

Attorney, As an Individual

Charles Sinclair

And when was that submitted?

9:05 a.m.

Member, Caregivers Support Services

Pura Velasco

Yesterday, and they said they would give it to the committee.

9:05 a.m.

Attorney, As an Individual

Charles Sinclair

And who did you give it to?

9:05 a.m.

Member, Caregivers Support Services

Pura Velasco

Denise....

9:05 a.m.

Attorney, As an Individual

Charles Sinclair

According to Ms. Velasco, it was given to the clerk's office.

9:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

I'm sorry to interrupt you, but we do not have your brief. But you can proceed.

9:05 a.m.

Member, Caregivers Support Services

Pura Velasco

Okay.

In the interests of time, I will just focus on what we would like to inform you of.

Because of the exposé of the conditions and status of live-in caregivers in Toronto and in some other places, we would like to say to the committee that we think it is the responsibility of elected officials to level the unequal playing fields that exist between employers and workers, and that the inaction of both the federal and the provincial governments of all political parties further accentuates the power imbalance that imperils migrant workers into a position of vulnerability.

It is imperative that this committee hear this evidence and evidence from other grass-roots organizations, such as Justice for Migrant Workers, and from temporary foreign workers engaged in the industry.

We have the following demands that we would like you to act upon: first, that all temporary foreign workers should be given immediate permanent residency; second, that there should be an end to the mandatory live-in requirement; third, that there be an end to all recruitment and placement fees charged by agencies and recruiters, including employers, and that the federal government develop strategies to prevent third-party recruiters from charging migrant workers recruitment placement fees in other jurisdictions, including foreign countries.

Thank you.

9:10 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Thank you.

9:10 a.m.

Attorney, As an Individual

Charles Sinclair

Mr. Chair, Ms. Gordo is going to make a statement now.

9:10 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Thank you, sir.

9:10 a.m.

Magdalene Gordo Member, Caregivers Support Services

Good morning to everyone. My name is Magdalene Gordo. I am a caregiver under the federal live-in caregiver program. I am also a member of the Caregiver Support Services.

In January 2008 I met Lyda Alvarez. I asked her if she knew of a place or an agency. Then she told me about the Akemi Taniguchi agency. Lyda Alvarez accompanied me to the Akemi Taniguchi agency. After I had been interviewed by Akemi regarding my status in Canada and other pertinent information, she asked me whether I would like to go for a job interview with Ruby Dhalla in Mississauga, and I said yes.

On January 30, 2008, Akemi informed me through Lyda that I had a scheduled interview with Ruby Dhalla on February 1. Akemi called Lyda, because at the time I did not have a telephone yet. On February 1, Lyda accompanied me to the Dhalla residence. I thought she was just keeping me company, as I was not familiar with the area. It turned out that she was there to get her unpaid wages from when she quit.

When we reached the Dhalla residence, Tavinder Dhalla, the mother of Ruby, let us in and asked us to wait for Ruby Dhalla. When Ruby came down, she invited us to sit with her in the family room. Before dealing with me, Ruby had settled her under-the-table transaction with Lyda Alvarez. She paid Lyda her unpaid wages. Once their transaction was over, Ruby started to interview me. She asked me about personal information, contact information, and my immigration status in Canada, my arrival date, and the other pertinent information.

During that interview, Lyda and Ruby's uncle were also sitting in the family room. Tavinder, who let us inside the house, went upstairs as soon as Ruby came down to greet us.

At the interview, Ruby asked me whether I'm a caregiver. I told her that I am and that I was under the federal government live-in caregiver program. She asked me where I came from, to which I answered that I came from the Philippines, but I had applied to participate in the LCP in Taiwan, because I was working there at the time.

Ruby asked me more questions about myself, and then she started discussing with me the job description and the conditions to be made. At this point, Tavinder came to join us and started to list down my duties and responsibilities every day. The list included cooking, serving their meals, doing the laundry, vacuuming, cleaning the whole house from the second, first, and the basement floors, organizing the clothes, bed-making, and all the household chores. Those included cleaning all the washrooms, toilets, and baths every day and mopping up the hardwood floors on hands and knees.

After the enumeration and listing of the jobs with Ruby and her mother Tavinder, I asked Ruby if she could sponsor me, and Ruby said, “Absolutely, I am a member of Parliament and I could easily apply for a work permit for you.” Upon hearing her promise, I was excited, and very happy to have passed the interview. Ruby then asked me to come back on Sunday night, on February 3, 2008. She also asked me to start working on February 4, 2008.

On her way home, Lyda told me the reason she quit working for Ruby Dhalla. She told me that she was upset that Ruby Dhalla had wasted her time by not fulfilling her promise of applying for a labour market opening for Lyda.

On February 3, 2008, at 6 p.m., a friend of mine dropped me off at the Dhalla residence. I introduced my friend to Ruby, who was in front of the house with her relatives. She told me that she was happy I had come.

After she introduced me to her relatives, she took me to the kitchen and asked me to clean and organize the kitchen cabinets. “I love to see things in order and very clean”, she said. And on my first night of work, she commanded me as to what I would be doing next and the job that I had to do next in the morning. She told me how to prepare breakfast and the rest of the jobs that I would have to do the next day. She wanted me to do good work.

The next night, Ruby celebrated her birthday, exclusively attended by her family and relatives. The birthday party ended at two o'clock the following morning.

The whole day was with Madame Tavinder. She told me that I should call her Madame Tavinder and that I should call Ruby and Neil “Doctor Ruby” and “Doctor Neil”. Madame Tavinder showed me how to prepare breakfast for Dr. Neil and then oriented me about how the general cleaning of the house could be done. She instructed me that on Wednesday I would be cleaning Sonia and Sukhbir's basement apartment.

Wednesday came, Sonia picked me up in the morning, and instructed me how to clean her apartment that she shared with Sukhbir. She instructed me how to do the laundry and cook dinner. Madame Tavinder, at the end of the day, dropped me back at Dr. Ruby Dhalla's residence. That was the start of my cleaning Sonia's house every Wednesday. I felt like a vacuum cleaner being on loan to Sonia.

Dr. Ruby told me how much she appreciated my efforts in cleaning her cousin Sonia's apartment. She told me how pleased she was with my work performance. Ruby was home every Thursday and Friday until Monday. I asked her when she would file for a labour market opinion for me. She told me how she could start processing my LMO, when she could sense that I was hesitant to give her my passport.

Both Dr. Ruby and Madame Tavinder had asked for my passport several times, but I did not want to give it to them. I was convinced it was not right for them to ask for my personal documents.

On February 8, 2008, Madame Tavinder asked me to clean their chiropractic clinics, and I refused to do it. I told Madame Tavinder I would not clean the chiropractic clinics because I did not want to catch an illness from patients. I thought Drs. Ruby and Neil were medical doctors. I did not know they were chiropractors.

As the days went by, I felt uncomfortable and overworked, working from 7:30 a.m. until 11 p.m. doing various household chores, not caregiving jobs. I did not see any proof that she would fulfill her promise of sponsoring me. She did not fill out the advertisement required for filling in the LMO. She and her mother repeatedly insisted on asking for my passport.

There was one time when she angrily called me from her office in Mississauga, demanding that I should submit my passport. I told her I left it in my apartment. Ruby angrily shouted back with an order, “If you don't give your passport, then I will never sponsor you”. From this day on, I became concerned and terribly worried about my situation working for Dr. Ruby Dhalla without the proper documentation. I was worried about wasting my time and not being able to fulfill the 24 months within 36 months.

Dr. Neil was never involved in interviewing me, orienting me with job responsibilities, nor supervising me. He never introduced himself as my employer. He did not discuss employment issues with me. Akemi also did not have any transaction with Dr. Neil in regard to my hiring. The only interaction with him I had was when he showed me how to shine several of his shoes and how to prepare his suits daily. The only thing I remember of Dr. Neil was when he looked at me in a dirty and insulting way one morning when I was cleaning several pairs of shoes.

One morning Madame Tavinder all of a sudden commanded me to quickly wash the exterior and vacuum the interior of Dr. Neil's car. When he saw me wiping the mirror of his car with a smooth cloth, he yelled at me, “No, no, no, no, don't you ever touch my mirror; you might scratch it badly. You're stupid. Do I still have to tell you this simple thing? You must go through car wash training first.”

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Excuse me.

Mr. Sinclair, I'd like to interrupt for just a minute. We're well over ten minutes. Is it the intention that the other witness wishes to make an opening statement as well?

9:15 a.m.

Attorney, As an Individual

Charles Sinclair

It is, Mr. Chair. Perhaps I could ask Ms. Gordo to wrap her statement up and then Ms. Tongson to perhaps summarize her statement. I appreciate we're over time already.

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Do I have the committee's permission to allow these people to go on a little further?

9:15 a.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.