Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Dec. 3rd, 2012

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

You have five minutes.

[Jay Aspin, Conservative, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Welcome to our guests. My questions would be relevant to the CBSA folks.

Do the CBSA, RCMP, and CSIS officers receive specialized training regarding names and cultural variations of names? For example, are they trained to search in the system for someone with four or five names, which order the names should be in, in what circumstances an individual might change the order of the names, etc.? If not, are there any plans to provide such training? Why, or why not?

[Peter Hill]

I can confirm that there is such training. Our national case management systems are being improved and updated, and these are the kinds of adjustments and improvements that are being made to ensure that very complex names based on different cultures are factored into the way data is collected. Training is provided in association with the use of our information technology systems.

[Jay Aspin, Conservative, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Thank you.

In your opinion, would the electronic travel authorization, or ETA, and the entry/exit provisions in the perimeter agreement prevent foreign criminals from abusing our generous immigration system?

[Peter Hill]

I strongly believe that. I believe that the entry/exit program that's being piloted will strengthen national security and law enforcement. My colleague has mentioned examples. It will help to track the fact that removals have been confirmed. It will allow us to track whether there are overstays. It will enhance our ability to ensure that residency requirements are being met. These are very fundamental capacities that have not been part of our management suite. We believe they're a strong addition to our ability to ensure the integrity of our borders.

[Jay Aspin, Conservative, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Will the government be able to know every single time someone makes an entry or exit between Canada and the United States, even at a land crossing?

[Peter Hill]

Indeed. The entry/exit program is set up so that the entry information for one country becomes the exit information for the other country at the land border. This program will enhance our ability to track the movement of individuals who cross our borders, to confirm who is coming and whether they're legitimate, and to prevent the system from being abused by those who are conducting illegal business or who are otherwise trying to abuse our systems.

[Jay Aspin, Conservative, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

In your opinion, will this help our government crack down on residency fraud and on people who want Canadian status without living here or paying into the system?

[Peter Hill]

I do believe it will.

[Jay Aspin, Conservative, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Would you say that an electronic travel authorization, or ETA, will help CBSA and CIC officers do their job?

[Peter Hill]

Indeed, we believe it will. It will allow us to manage and mitigate risks as far away from our geographic borders as possible and prevent inadmissible people from entering Canadian territory.

[Jay Aspin, Conservative, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Thank you.

If I have any time left, Mr. Chair—

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

You have a minute.

[Jay Aspin, Conservative, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

—I'd like to share it with Mr. Weston.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you, generous new colleague.

This might not be so complicated a question, but we've been doing this study, I think since January, and we've covered different types of people—people coming to study in Canada, people coming for tourism, people coming for permanent residency. We have touched on various provisions regarding increased security. I'm wondering if one or the other of you could give us a matrix, or at least paint a matrix in our minds, as to which of these provisions touch which groups of those who desire to come to Canada. I have the impression that not all of the security provisions we're talking about touch all of those who want to come.

[Les Linklater]

I'll attempt to do it in less than a minute.

Essentially, we have two broad groups of people who travel to Canada as tourists, visitors, business people, or foreign students. Some require a visa and some don't. Under the ETA, we will require those who don't require a visa today to obtain an ETA before they come to Canada. U.S. citizens will be exempt in the same way Canadian citizens are exempt from the U.S. ESTA program.

As for the biometrics program, we will be asking for biometrics from a certain subset of nationals from countries that do require a visa today, as I said, based on our assessment and analysis of risks that those populations present to Canada. So of the 150 countries that require a visa for entry into Canada, there will be a subset that will be required to submit biometrics as well. For citizens of the 50 or so countries exempt from the visa, all except American citizens will be subject to the ETA.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Dykstra, you have four minutes.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Thanks, Chair.

I'd like to pursue a bit further the whole issue around the electronic travel authorization—this committee spent up to two meetings discussing it—in terms of the direction the government is taking with respect to our budget bill, and the implementation. One of the concerns that has been brought forward is the intended use and purpose of the authorization.

Could you expand a bit on your earlier response to Ms. James in terms of how exactly this will be used with respect to those travelling into the country?

[Les Linklater]

At the present time—and colleagues from CBSA may want to add to this as well—individuals from countries and territories that are exempt from the visa requirement are only examined by a Canadian official once they arrive at a port of entry. At that point, it's very difficult for Border Services officers to be able to ask people to leave Canada, if they are improperly documented or found to be otherwise inadmissible. Once they are on Canadian territory, individuals can make claims for refugee protection, which puts them into a different stream of activity. We then move them through that process, depending on their eligibility.

With an ETA, we will be able to address the majority of those threats and risks from visa-exempt nationals before they board the plane to come to Canada. As Mr. Hill said, it's pushing the risks as far away from our actual physical geographic borders as possible. In the case of refugee claimants, under the new system we will save Canadian taxpayers about $29,000 a year for a failed claimant.

With regard to the other side of the coin, the facilitation side, once we've been able to assess an individual who is travelling to Canada, say the president of a multinational corporation based in Europe, and they've secured an ETA, we will be able to facilitate their travel to Canada. We will know they are bona fide, legitimate, that they have business interests or frequent travel to Canada. That would allow our Border Services officers at the port of entry where they arrive to give a very light touch, as opposed to the type of examination that's carried out now.

We look at this as pushing risks offshore, but at the same time ensuring that, for those legitimate travellers who receive the ETA, their travel to Canada will be facilitated to the extent that is possible.

I'll ask CBSA whether they have anything to add.

[Geoffrey Leckey]

Mr. Linklater suggested that his CBSA colleagues might have something to add, but I think his answer was pretty good.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Don't tell him that in public, for Pete's sake.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you.

I have one question.

What measures can be taken to identify and screen out people of concern who appear to be bona fide visitors or students because they have come to Canada via multiple countries?

[Les Linklater]

Essentially, if an individual wishes to come to Canada under the new regime and they're visa-exempt, with the ETA we will be required to have a record. They will be required to provide us with their information so we can do an initial screen before they arrive in Canada, regardless of the country they have applied from. It will have to do with their nationality and the passport they carry. If we are at that time made aware of any issues, as I said, they can be referred to the nearest Canadian visa office for a follow-up interview with a CIC officer. That would be to determine whether or not an ETA should be issued, regardless of where they are physically—if they're in transit, or what have you.

From that perspective, being able to manage the flow of travellers to Canada...eventually with the rollout of the ETA with CBSA's interactive advance passenger information system, our ports of entry will know who is coming before they leave the airport their flight originates from. Right now we do get advance passenger information, but it's after the wheels are up. At that point, it's too late to make a board/no board decision. With an ETA, we'll be able to work with airlines to ensure that people who are of concern, who don't possess an ETA, don't actually get on the flight to come to Canada.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

They simply wouldn't arrive.