The motion—
Evidence of meeting #131 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was countries.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #131 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was countries.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
You can't rule me out of order. I'm speaking to the motion.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Rob Oliphant
The motion was not presented in a manner that was understandable to me as the chair, and then it was changed three times.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Well, perhaps you should ask the mover to clarify it if you don't understand, Mr. Chairman.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Rob Oliphant
If the mover would like to make a clear motion, I would entertain it. However, we do not have a clear motion on the floor. Just to clarify, using the words “I'd like to make a motion” does not, in fact, make a motion.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
But you can't rule something out of order just because you don't understand.
Liberal
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Well, Mr. Chairman, you are out of order, and I'm saying this with all due respect to the witness. I'm not challenging the witness. I'm challenging you for taking it upon yourself to arrange for witnesses when you don't have the right to do that. The parties, the three caucuses, have the right to arrange for witnesses. If there were no witnesses, you should have called a subcommittee meeting and asked the three representatives what they intended to do.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Rob Oliphant
The call of a subcommittee meeting is totally at my behest, Mr. Tilson.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Well, you've chosen not to call it and to just do things on your own. Is that what you're trying to tell us? You don't have a right to do that.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Rob Oliphant
What I am saying is that Mr. Milner is a witness selected by the committee. He was asked to come to the committee in October. We have attempted to schedule him. He is now available.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Sir, I'm not challenging the witness. I'm challenging you, that you have acted—
Liberal
Conservative
Liberal
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Rob Oliphant
Okay. Then we need to vote to sustain the chair. It is not debatable.
All in favour of challenging the chair, please vote.
(Ruling of the chair sustained)
Thank you. I will continue.
I will give Ms. Rempel a chance to.... If you would like to put in a motion that is clear about instructing me to.... I think I got the point, but then it changed as you continued.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
Chair, when the original conversation happened—and I believe it was in public, so I'm not—
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
Okay.
I think a lot of the motion, from my understanding, could be discussed with.... Many Canadian departmental officials have been working on that particular issue. I think having the minister appear is important. My assumption is that the chair would be arranging witnesses who were from GAC, IRCC, the minister, and perhaps even our rapporteur, Ms. Arbour. I think that was more the spirit behind it. We could easily fill two meetings or more with Canadian officials, which you had already decided, so this isn't about babysitting, as you've characterized it; it's just that we have only one witness here. We have one witness, when we could have had a panel of many other departmental officials and whatnot.
I just find that a poor allocation of time, especially—
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Rob Oliphant
The departmental officials have been requested to come, and they are being scheduled.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Rob Oliphant
Mr. Milner was requested to come some time ago and was able to come today. We thought, “Isn't it lucky”—he may not think so now—“and fortuitous to the committee that he is able to be here.” He is a Canadian expert on the compact, is involved in it, and has already been scheduled.
Frankly, no other witnesses had been submitted—witnesses have now been submitted and officials have been requested—and that is why we are doing this.
The reality, just to remind the committee, is that you put a deadline of December 10 for us to accomplish this task. For us to get this task done, it is my job as the chair to make sure we have four meetings on this topic. That's how we're doing it.