Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 26th, 2018

[Larry Maguire, Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

I would like an explanation from the department as well on this, because their own results report states:

the Department centralized the intake of UNHCR referrals in Ottawa in an effort to support timely processing of government-supported refugees. Taking into consideration Canada’s referral needs, the UNHCR now has greater flexibility to submit referrals based on global resettlement pressures.

Ms. Greene, can you explain that to us? You've partly done so, I believe. What sort of flexibility does the UNHCR now have in our refugee system?

[Susan Greene]

Unfortunately, I'm a policy director, not in charge of our operations. I'd be happy to connect with our operations colleagues to be very precise as to what those flexibilities might be.

[Larry Maguire, Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Why would that statement be in the report then? I would think there is an understanding that there are going to be some changes adopted.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'm afraid I need to end you there. That is five minutes.

That brings the first hour of our meeting to an end at five o'clock, as we've agreed.

We invite the parliamentary secretary to go to another commitment. The officials are invited to stay, as long as the committee members still have questions.

We'll just suspend for one minute.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I call this meeting back to order.

Thank you, officials, for staying and bringing your expertise.

We're going to continue the speaking order and finish this round.

If members decide that they have answers to their questions, we don't need to fill out the time. If you feel you want to keep going, we'll keep going until six o'clock, but it will be very much up to you.

Go ahead, Ms. Zahid, for five minutes.

[Salma Zahid, Scarborough Centre, Lib.]

Thank you, Chair, and thanks to the officials for coming today.

Is there any cost associated with the development of this compact and will there be any costs going forward on that?

[Glen Linder]

I can answer with respect to the global compact on migration.

There are no out-of-pocket costs to the Government of Canada in terms of implementation. It's very much a decision of the government of the day as to what they would like to do.

There are opportunities for the government to make contributions to capacity-building and to funding the International Organization for Migration to deliver some of the coordination work the compact asks it to do, but there's no requirement for the Government of Canada to make those contributions. At this time, no decision has been made as to whether the government will do so, so there is no cost with respect to the global compact on migration.

With respect to the global compact on refugees, I will turn it to Mr. Salewicz.

[Stephen Salewicz, Director General, International Humanitarian Assistance, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development]

Indeed, the global compact on refugees looks at a more comprehensive approach to responding to refugee needs. It brings different tools together to explore opportunities for improving the outcomes for refugees, but there are no costs associated with that. It looks at existing resources being better used to respond to those needs.

[Salma Zahid]

This question is for the IRCC officials. Would ratification of the two global compacts by Canada require any changes in Canada's current policies or practices with regard to migration and refugees?

[Glen Linder]

With respect to the global compact on migration, it would not require us to do anything. What it does do is provide us a useful list of best practices that we can review. As part of the government's regular decision-making process, if we choose to adopt new practices or to amend current practices, that is, again, a decision that the government of the day can make as it considers any new policy decisions.

With respect to the global compact on refugees, I will turn to Ms. Greene.

[Susan Greene]

With regard to the global compact on refugees, the situation is very much the same. This is not a binding agreement in any way. The government of the day will always have the right to amend policies as it sees fit and based on evidence, but not because of any compulsion by the compact.

[Glen Linder]

Ms. Kent.

[Deirdre Kent, Director General, International Assistance Policy, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development]

I will supplement and make a point of clarification further to Ms. Greene's point about it being a non-binding compact among states. It won't be ratified; it will be adopted by states. It is not a treaty and, therefore, it won't be ratified.

[Salma Zahid]

This is for the IRCC officials. Why is it important to take a multilateral approach to issues such as migration and refugees?

[Susan Greene]

I think what we all see is that refugee crises are really regional problems. We wouldn't want them to be crises that only one country bears the burden of. The multilateral system and multilateral approaches have been proven to be effective and efficient in helping to manage large-scale, complex issues such as what we see taking place with the refugee crises around the world today.

[Glen Linder]

With respect to the global compact on migration, and to migration issues generally, I think you're putting your finger on a really important point. Migration and the determination of who a country allows to enter onto its territory is one of the most fundamental attributes of the sovereignty of a country, so your question is well taken.

The point, though, is that the global compact on migration recognizes that practically every country in the world can be a country of origin, a country of transit and a country of destination, and, in most cases, is all three. Because of the journey that migrants take, the multilateral approach is helpful so that we can leverage each other's different approaches, so that we can have consistency in border management to a greater extent and so that we can have that level of global co-operation to manage these very large migration movements that we're experiencing right now.

[Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

[David Tilson, Conservative, Dufferin—Caledon, ON]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

I notice the meeting tomorrow is not televised, and yet the minister is appearing. Can you tell us why the meeting is not televised?

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

Yes, and I can also refer to the clerk. There are two rooms that have television available. We are the one committee that has a standing claim on television; however, if more than two committees request it, then the committees have to negotiate with each other, and because we are regularly televised and because the other committees are.... They have two ministers coming to public safety and national security, and the other is public accounts. Public accounts gets precedence over all other committees. Public safety and national security has two ministers coming in, and we have only one, so we lost it.

[David Tilson, Conservative, Dufferin—Caledon, ON]

Keep up the good work, Mr. Chairman.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

Thank you.

Mr. Stetski, welcome to CIMM. Go ahead for three minutes.

[Wayne Stetski, NDP, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Thank you.

I have two questions to try to get in.

LGBTQ groups are criminalized in over 60 countries around the world. Often, they can't cross the border to declare refugee status because the country next door has also criminalized LGBTQ. So the government introduced the rainbow RAP pilot project. Will you make it a permanent and a separate refugee stream?

[Susan Greene]

Yes, that pilot is still in place. I can't speak to its permanency, but it has been extended to March 2020, which is signalling the strong performance of that pilot project, and in particular the excellent work of the Rainbow Refugee Society.

We recognize entirely, in full agreement with you, that it is not always possible for members of the LGBTQ community to cross borders and to do so safely. Because of that, over this past year the Government of Canada through IRCC has been working very closely with representatives from the LGBTQ community across Canada and has developed a very strong dialogue on what exactly the risks are that individuals face and the settlement needs they require.

At this time, there are no plans to make a separate stream, but we always have at the minister's discretion the use of public policies that can allow him to support them and that have been used by the minister in the past to bring vulnerable members of the LGBT community to Canada.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'm just going to thank Ms. Greene for that answer, but just caution the member to try to keep on the topic of the global compacts. That was outside our scope today. You happened to get an official who happened to know the answer, but they may not be prepared for questions that are outside today's meeting. Just be cautious on that.

[Wayne Stetski, NDP, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Then just quickly, she also made reference to climate change refugees earlier on. I sit on the environment committee. I have a great deal of interest in that topic and the very dire warnings that have been coming forward internationally, most recently out of the United States.

Is there, then, an interest in potentially, under either of these agreements, including climate change refugees and what might that look like going forward?