Evidence of meeting #34 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was class.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Marwan Tabbara Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
For Mr. LeBlanc, I was mentioning that the best and brightest are trying to come to our region, to our country, but they have concerns about whether or not their family and extended family would be able to join them.
Executive Director, New Brunswick Multicultural Council
In various sectors, certainly from my perspective, the best and brightest doesn't necessarily mean that they're the highest educated. In some cases it could be skilled tradespeople. Recently we've opened up streams in New Brunswick hoping to facilitate entry into more semi-skilled occupations because we have an aging workforce and a shortage of workers in certain more physically intensive sectors.
In any event, on attracting economic immigrants to address gaps in our labour market, we have to look at what those family units are going to require, the requirements of those workers, those human resources who are going to come in and grow our economy. I think the requirements are to have a connection to their families, to be close, to build community, and to build a home in our country, wherever that is.
Family reunification, family-class immigration supports our economic objectives but is also part of the follow-through on our humanitarian objectives in terms of refugee resettlement.
Liberal
Marwan Tabbara Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
My second question is for Ms. Ghassemi and Mr. LeBlanc.
Many witnesses have come to this committee, have testified before it, and have talked about the aging out issue of dependent children, which is a real problem when applicants take a long time to be processed. Have you encountered any cases like these, and would you recommend a lock-in date for families?
Ms. Ghassemi first.
Executive Director, Newcomer Centre of Peel
I'm sorry, I didn't hear your last part of the question. Could you please repeat it?
Liberal
Marwan Tabbara Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
I was referring to the aging out issue, when children apply to come to Canada at a certain age, but then the process takes too long and they've aged out and may not be eligible. Have you experienced that in your field?
Executive Director, Newcomer Centre of Peel
Yes, indeed. It's a big issue when you use a number, say 19 years old, as dependence for children, and then if it comes to 22.... In different cultures we live with parents until we get married. Maybe we're 40 years old or 35 years old, and we still live with our parents. We are dependent according to our culture and definition on our family structure. Putting a number for aging people is very problematic. We should really reconsider that if children are living with parents, then we should not have an age for them.
Liberal
Marwan Tabbara Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
I'm concentrating on teenagers. Maybe they are 16 or 17, and then their process took a lot longer, and now they might be in their mid-twenties and they are not eligible when they process. I'm just focusing on that bracket.
Executive Director, Newcomer Centre of Peel
Okay. We should have the grandfather clause when you apply when your children are 16 or 17, and then you have to really focus on when they applied and when their age was 16 or 17.
Liberal
Marwan Tabbara Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
You would be in favour of a lock-in date, correct?
Executive Director, New Brunswick Multicultural Council
Yes, as well. We'd be in favour of a lock-in date, providing that there would be some planning around that and defining what the lock-in date is. We believe, and it's been raised in our organization several times, that not allowing dependents who are within one or two years of the age of 18 to be part of the family class is unreasonable.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
There was an internal departmental study done recently that concluded that the economic outcomes of parents and grandparents are below the average of other immigrants, with fewer than half reporting employment income, with low average earnings, and with increased EI usage over time. In other words, the department said this was a drain on the economy. In addition, the parents and grandparents population is largely responsible for the disproportionately high rate of family-class immigrants reporting social assistance usage as compared to all immigrants. This study was done by the department.
I wonder if we could have a comment about that from all three witnesses, starting with Professor Reitz.
Professor, R.F. Harney Ethnic, Immigration and Pluralism Studies, University of Toronto, As an Individual
As I indicated before, in discussing the question of the family class generally, I think that if you want to assess the economic impact of the presence of the people in Canada, then you can't look only at their earnings. You have to look at the earnings of the family unit, at a minimum. It's not surprising to me that the earnings would be lower.
I wanted to clarify. You said their earnings were lower than, did you mean lower than mainstream Canadians of the same age?
October 25th, 2016 / 4:25 p.m.
Conservative
Professor, R.F. Harney Ethnic, Immigration and Pluralism Studies, University of Toronto, As an Individual
The immigrants of the same age?
Professor, R.F. Harney Ethnic, Immigration and Pluralism Studies, University of Toronto, As an Individual
All other immigrants?
Professor, R.F. Harney Ethnic, Immigration and Pluralism Studies, University of Toronto, As an Individual
Well, you might say the appropriate comparison would be people in the same demographic category. I think that's not a proper economic model. The census of Canada is very clear to identify families as economic units. They call it “economic family”. The census data are collected in such a way that you can examine the economic interdependence of members of the family. When I comes to immigration, I think that to select certain streams, and measure their economic contribution only in terms of their own particular employment, is a conceptual mistake.
Executive Director, New Brunswick Multicultural Council
I'm working from research done by Professor Yoko Yoshida from Dalhousie University that indicates that the economic immigrants coming to New Brunswick report roughly 74% employment after year one and that family-class immigrants are on a par with the economic immigrants who come to our province in terms of labour market participation. Their earnings are lower, but they are earning and they're participating in the labour market. It will take people working in various capacities in our economy to drive it forward. We're not all going to be engineers or doctors or entrepreneurs in the tech sector. I believe it's a misnomer to suggest this. It takes all parts to drive this engine. I agree with the professor as well.
Executive Director, Newcomer Centre of Peel
I agree with both Professor Reitz and Alex. I always think and ask, what do you mean by low earnings? What is poverty? Many cultures believe in a very simplified life that in your opinion as a western citizen makes you think they're so poor because they don't have meat every night or this and that. But we live a very humble and simple life that is so comfortable for us, and we don't call this a low level of earning and lifestyle. That is different. I think it goes back to the culture of the family and the culture of people who come and then want to live together happily. I don't think money can play a big issue in being healthy and happy living in Canada.
