Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Feb. 10th, 2022

[Pirita Mattola]

We have been working with the provincial government, the Ministry of Advanced Education, to look into the numbers a bit more, and to have some institutional data as well.

This is just my opinion at the moment—there's no hard data—but some of it has to do with, again, the student direct streams and where the applicants are coming from. Depending on what your largest source countries of international students are, it could affect different institutions in different ways.

The other question I have had in my mind, going back to the significant role that individual immigration officers play in assessing applications, is bias in decision-making, whether it's regarding the applicants or the destination as well. I know that we are a less-known international education destination and province. Sometimes there's unawareness of what Saskatchewan can offer. I've wondered if that has played a role in decision-making at times as well.

[Rosemarie Falk, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

In your own opinion, would you say that there may be unique commonalities among applicants looking to study in Saskatchewan who are refused?

[Pirita Mattola]

Unique considerations?

[Rosemarie Falk, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

I mean commonalities among the applicants.

[Pirita Mattola]

I think there are regional differences between where larger institutions get their international students from. That may have something to do with why Saskatchewan numbers look the way they do. I'm not sure, again, if that explains all of it.

Hopefully in the future, as markets diversify and students come from other places as well, we'll see a positive trend with the approval rates.

[Rosemarie Falk, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

I have one more thing regarding this. Does the U of S track data on refusal rates for students looking to study at the U of S? Are you tracking that specifically?

[Pirita Mattola]

We do have some data. Our data actually looks a lot better in some ways for initial applicants and renewals.

As an institution, I wouldn't say that we are in a bad position in any way. Again, I do recognize that there are many other designated learning institutions in the province that may be smaller. That comes with unique challenges as well in this kind of province.

[Rosemarie Falk, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Yes, for sure.

You had mentioned about having strong two-way relations with international students. What does that look like? Is that in reference to prior to recruitment versus post-graduate or is it throughout the whole process that there are those two-way relations?

[Pirita Mattola]

I would go back to what I said again about transactional relations and really recognizing that students could and should be able to contribute to the workforce a little bit more during their studies. It could help with their integration and long-term success. Eventually it could help the entire country and our province—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting. Your time is up.

[Rosemarie Falk, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Wonderful. Thank you so much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We will now proceed to Mr. Dhaliwal.

Mr. Dhaliwal, you will have four minutes for your round of questioning. You can proceed, please.

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

Thank you.

Madam Chair, recently I had the opportunity to tour KPU in my constituency. It's the only polytechnic university in Canada, so I'm very proud of the work and the leadership that KPU provides.

Madam Chair, when we look at the numbers, 30% international student enrolment at KPU seems to be very high. I would like to know from Madame St. Laurent what some of the reasons are that international students are attracted to KPU instead of other traditional post-secondary institutions in Canada.

[Carole St. Laurent]

Thank you so much for your question.

KPU has developed a good relationship in some countries in particular. Because of the population that we're seeing in the Lower Mainland, it is attractive for international students—particularly from India—to come to Canada.

The strong linkages with industry and employment is something that students seek.

Again, we have some of the smaller classes. As far as a university goes, you don't see many universities where you have a maximum class size of 30 students. It's more like something in a college set-up or a rural area.

The small class size, the integration into the community and the hands-on experience are very attractive for students. All students have either a co-op experience or some type of not only academic, but also hands-on experience to better prepare them for their jobs.

Most students get jobs. More than 90% of students get jobs in their area of study. That's really important to international students.

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

Madam Chair, the other thing I'm hearing on the doorsteps is that international students are taking spots from the local students.

Is that true?

[Carole St. Laurent]

I'm sorry, are you asking if some international students are taking the place of domestic students?

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

That's correct.

[Carole St. Laurent]

That's something that, as an institution, we need to ensure does not happen.

We're seeing our domestic population gradually decrease. We're replacing that with international students, but by no means are we to displace any domestic students for international students.

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

IRCC has used analytical and artificial intelligence in processing TRV applications, particularly from India, as you mentioned.

To your knowledge, have the international students from Indian been affected by IRCC's use of data analytics to try to get temporary visas to study in Canada?

[Carole St. Laurent]

It was really interesting, because some of them, when we....

Are you talking about when they introduced the two-step process?

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

Yes.

[Carole St. Laurent]

That was the other thing that was very strange. Typically, if you are approved in the first step, it's pretty much assured that, unless something goes unreasonably wrong, you'll be approved in the second step. Then, going back to some of the previous comments, it was about dual intent, and they were saying, “You're not approved because of this dual intent”, which makes absolutely no sense. It had a serious impact on our students, and not just from India but from across the globe. They were given approval in that first step but not in the second step.

We do have a pretty significant approval rate for Indian students, in excess of 80%, but there are really significant delays in the approval process, which is significantly impacting the future of these students.

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Mr. Dhaliwal. Your time is up.

We will now proceed to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.

Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, you have two minutes for your round of questioning. Please proceed.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ms. St. Laurent, I just want to make sure I understood correctly. In the last intervention, you told us that you don't reimburse international students who started their term and whose study permit was subsequently refused, because they had in fact taken courses.

I'll ask you a $10,000 question. Is their degree valid at that point?