Citizenship and Immigration Committee on April 26th, 2023

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

The question could have been answered by yes or no. I unfortunately wasted a lot of time on this.

NGOs are asking why we didn't just create an exemption, as has been done in different countries. You must have been involved in the discussions, for example, on UN Security Council Resolution 2615, which simply asked us to exempt NGOs and allowed a humanitarian exemption under international humanitarian law or the Geneva Convention. It would have been so simple to implement that resolution.

You were involved in those conversations, as we were told that all the departments were talking to each other—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, but your time is up.

We will now proceed to Ms. Kwan for two and a half minutes.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you.

I just want to ask about the interdepartmental efforts.

At the Special Committee on Afghanistan, one of the recommendations was for the government to actually review the undertakings of the Afghanistan situation and propose recommendations, as well as review what worked, what didn't and what needs to be improved. Has that work been done in your department?

[Marie-Louise Hannan]

Yes. The government response was tabled, I think, in October 2022, and a number of items that Global Affairs Canada is responsible for have been worked on in the intervening times since that crisis.

I can confirm that a number of reviews have taken place, including examining the interdepartmental effort. In a situation as large and complex as this one and involving so many departments, it's normal that it takes some time to review how we could improve our response.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

With respect this department's response, is there a separate, individual report related to this that has been completed? If so, can that be tabled with the committee for review?

[Marie-Louise Hannan]

I believe this is very similar to a question asked earlier about the after-action review. I responded by saying that this review has been completed for Global Affairs Canada, and I am not aware of the status of the report or whether that can be shared. However, we will endeavour to take that back to colleagues who are responsible under the emergency management and consular management part of the department to follow up on, and we'll ask whether that can be shared.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you.

I will just read into the record recommendation one, the latter part of it. It says:

Furthermore, that the Government of Canada, while protecting any security clearance requirements, share the full outcome of its review with all relevant departments and agencies, and summarize the review's main findings in its response to this Special Committee's report.

The government accepted these recommendations. If these reports have been completed, none have been tabled that I'm aware of. Why is that? That's what I'm concerned about.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, Ms. Kwan, but your time is up.

We will now proceed to Mr. Redekopp for three and a half minutes, and then we will end the panel with three and a half minutes for the Liberal side.

Mr. Redekopp, you have three and a half minutes.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to put this motion on notice:

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2): (a) the committee extend the total number of meetings currently allocated to the current study regarding the Government’s response to the final report of the Special Committee on Afghanistan by one meeting, to be held prior to Thursday, June 1, 2023; and (b) Mr. George Young be invited to appear for two hours, at a date and time to be fixed by the Chair, but no later than Thursday, June 1, 2023, to discuss matters related to the current study.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'll pass my time to Mr. Maguire.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Okay.

Go ahead, Mr. Maguire.

[Larry Maguire, Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thanks to my colleague.

Ms. Hannan, you mentioned earlier the diplomacy involved in some of the discussions that have taken place among, I believe you mentioned, various departments. Can you elaborate a little on that and what you mean by “diplomacy involved” to that extent? How has that developed through the different departments and how many are involved?

[Marie-Louise Hannan]

Could I please seek a clarification? Is this pertaining to the Afghanistan situation in August 2021, or is this a broader question?

[Larry Maguire, Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

It's a broader question in reference to your comment in your first answers with regard to the diplomacy involved.

[Marie-Louise Hannan]

I believe in my earlier answers I said that in general, when we're talking about a situation of evacuation of Canadian citizens, it's an emergency or crisis situation and there is quite a lot of diplomacy involved. What I mean by “diplomacy” is our interactions with other countries.

As part of the mandate of Global Affairs Canada and our 170-plus locations around the world, we establish relationships with host governments and with a number of government departments wherever we're located. We really use those relationships when a crisis emerges. We also use our relationships with the diplomats representing their countries in those locations to see if we can work out solutions and be as helpful as possible, and to turn some of those relationships into solutions to assist Canadians in a time of emergency or in a time of crisis.

[Larry Maguire, Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

You also made reference to reliance. I'm not referring to just the Afghan situation or even the Sudanese situation that's arising right now. Is any of that tied to the situation in Ukraine as well?

[Marie-Louise Hannan]

I apologize, but I'll just ask if the question can be repeated and if this is a question on reliance. I think I heard that word, but I am not sure.

[Larry Maguire, Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Yes. I'm using your word from your opening remarks. There was a reliance that you said you were dealing with in regard to some of those areas, and it refers to Afghanistan and the current situation in Sudan. Are there any separate rules used there or any parallels between what you've been able to learn about reliance in the situation today and in the present situation in Ukraine?

[Marie-Louise Hannan]

When I use the word “reliance”, what I am referring to is that we rely on our existing relationships; we rely on the networks that are established. As diplomats working for Canada abroad, we actually invest quite a lot of time and effort into establishing those networks and those relationships. Then we can rely on them to help us find solutions to problems such as in an emergency situation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you. The time is up for Mr. Maguire.

We will now proceed to Ms. Kayabaga for the last three and a half minutes before we end this panel.

Ms. Kayabaga, please begin.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to first thank the officials for staying for the full two hours and continuing to respond to the committee's questions on this specific issue.

Earlier we were talking about some of the lessons we have learned or can learn and can continue to use in other situations. Can you comment on how Canada can work with international partners and organizations to support the rights and empowerment of women and girls in Afghanistan and in other countries facing similar challenges? We know there are crises arising around the world, and right now the most pressing one is the situation in Sudan. In connection with my question earlier on some of the lessons we are learning and have learned, what are some of the bridges you're looking to continue to build with other countries and organizations to make sure we're there for women and girls in situations like this?

[Stephen Salewicz]

Indeed this is the focus of a lot of work on the humanitarian front. My colleagues here might have other answers, but on the humanitarian front, our focus has been continuing to learn how to improve protection from violence during crises like this.

The targeting of women and girls during crises like this is an unfortunate outcome, actually, and a lot of our focus and a lot of the efforts we make as a country within the international sector are about how to protect women and girls in these contexts and how to advance their rights through international humanitarian law and by supporting partners who advocate for their rights and who indeed remain on the ground in situ during conflicts to advance and try to protect women in these contexts.

[Marie-Louise Hannan]

Thank you. I think I can complement that.

I believe that you're looking for examples of ways we engage with other countries. I think a very good one is through our ambassador for women, peace and security. That mechanism is very effective at bringing the focus to conflict situations and other crises around the world. It looks at how we can engage using a feminist lens to consider the unique impacts on women and how women can engage with other women in order to find solutions to challenges and a way forward, again using diplomacy.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

I'm of the same opinion. When it comes to conflicts and resolutions in countries that are experiencing war, I believe that women should be at the forefront—they are not yet—because they have a lot to lose. Women lose their children. They lose their homes. They lose their communities. They lose so much, and they're not part of the conflict creation but are often removed from those conversations. I really appreciate you commenting on that and talking about the importance of keeping women at the forefront.

I don't have time for another question, but thank you so much for taking these questions from us.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

With that, this panel has come to an end.

On behalf of all the members of the committee, I really want to thank officials for staying with us for two hours and answering all of those questions.

Is it the will of the committee to adjourn the meeting?

[Some hon. members]

Yes.