Evidence of meeting #65 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was amendments.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid
I'll stop the clock. I'll get the translation checked.
Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, you can begin, please.
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Hello.
This was not the meeting I was expecting, because I wanted to shed some light on it. However, I am learning some rather surprising information.
Mr. Emery, we have never met. I even think that when you came here to testify, I wasn't present, because I was replacing someone on another committee, is that right?
4:55 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
It just cut out right at the end, but I believe the member's question was that we have never met. The answer to that is that, yes, we have never met.
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Right. We have never had any communication, whether by email, text message or any other means, is that right?
4:55 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
That is correct.
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Excellent. Things are starting off well.
You spoke about Michèle Vallée, but you also spoke about the Liberal Party and Vanessa Cranston. You talked to Jenny Kwan.
I believe you when you say you are here to tell the truth. It is just that I am surprised, because when subamendments started being proposed to the NDP amendments, I was the one who said that I had not received them and that I had the impression that people had been talking to each other without me. Now, however, I am told that it may have been the Bloc Québécois that provided the NDP amendments to a stakeholder. That is what I don't understand in all this.
4:55 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
I'm sorry. The translation cut out.
What I don't understand in that—
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Madam Chair, this has to be fixed, because it is too important. This is really a joke.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid
I will stop the clock. Let us check.
Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, can you just say a few sentences? Let's see if we can....
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
It's pretty important, so I would like to make sure it's working. You understand?
Is the interpretation working? Please tell me it's working. Suspend the meeting if necessary, but fix it for me, Madam Chair.
Thank you.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid
We will get it checked.
I'll suspend the meeting for two minutes so that the clerk can have a look at what the problem is.
I call this meeting to order.
Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, please start from the beginning because there were some issues with the translation.
5 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Thank you, Madam Chair. I will start over from the beginning.
Mr. Emery, we have already confirmed that we have never met, so I have just one question. I know you are here to tell the truth. I have no doubt about that. You seem to be a very respectable person, even though we have never met and this is the first time we have spoken.
Just before the Conservatives produced this famous email that you wrote, which said that you had certain information, the Liberals had started moving subamendments, and I told the committee that I had never seen them and I was not expecting that. I asked whether it was possible, since there were very complicated things being proposed, to speak to all members of the committee so that my team and I, and the research staff, could prepare.
What I can't understand in this whole thing is that that the Bloc Québécois is suddenly being said to possibly be connected with all this, when I was not even aware, myself, that the Liberals had moved subamendments in response to the NDP amendments and that the Conservatives had an email coming from you.
Since the beginning of this whole thing, I said to myself that it has nothing to do with me, that I will let it go ahead and we will see what happens. So you will kind of understand my surprise when I hear you naming the Bloc Québécois in all this. Basically, can you enlighten me?
5 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
I can say that is what I heard. I understand that this is not a court of law where hearsay is—
5 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
I'm just speaking truthfully. That's the information I had.
5 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Did you hear that it was the Bloc Québécois that had sent out the Liberal subamendments?
5 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
That is not correct. Subamendments—
5 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Ah, okay. So, that's false. However, in the email sent to the Conservatives, am I dreaming or does it refer to the Liberal subamendments?
5:05 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
Yes.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Okay. I'm not sure I understand.
So, in the email sent to the Conservatives, it refers to the Liberal subamendments. You are telling me that it was not the Bloc Québécois that provided those subamendments to you. We are all wondering how you were aware of the Liberal subamendments. I don't see why there is any mention of the Bloc Québécois in this whole thing. Essentially, that is pretty much what I am asking myself.
5:05 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
I'm speaking—
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
I'm sorry. I'm surprised. So these are really the questions that come to my mind. I am almost thinking out loud.
5:05 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
Just to be clear, I did not receive any amendment or subamendment language from any member or staff. I received general information on strategy. What I communicated in my email reflected an anticipation of the execution of that strategy with regard to subamendments. With regard to specific numbers, those I did receive.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Right, but the Liberals obviously did not send me the subamendments they were going to move, since I was the first to be surprised when they moved them. So, and I repeat, the Bloc Québécois could not have sent out those subamendments, because that would mean that the Liberals had informed me of them. That is impossible. That is what I don't understand in all this.
5:05 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Citizens Rights Council, As an Individual
I'm sorry. What was—