Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 20th, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

I call this meeting to order.

We are meeting in public.

Welcome to meeting number 95 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration.

Today for a briefing on the temporary immigration measures initiated in response to the ongoing conflicts in Sudan and Gaza, we have the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship, the Honourable Marc Miller, with departmental officials.

Madam Kwan, do you have something to say?

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

I do. Before we begin, Mr. Chair, I know that, because of votes, we've lost almost 45 minutes of the two hours the minister was supposed to appear and then one hour for the officials.

I would like to hear from you how we will be making up that time. Will we be extending the meeting tonight so we can get the full two hours with the minister? If not, then I would—

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

I'm coming to that, Madam Kwan. If you can give me time to end, you will know. Let me finish up, then I'll give you the floor.

Joining him are departmental officials, Deputy Minister Dr. Harpreet Singh Kochhar, Assistant Deputy Minister Jennifer MacIntyre and Director General Karim Virani.

Welcome to the meeting.

Minister, you've been very accessible to this committee. I know that almost every week that we sit you are here, and I want to thank you for making the time to come here to be with the members.

The hard stop for the minister is at 6:30. He does not have time today to go beyond 6:30, and the hard stop with the officials will be 7:30.

There are six other motions for him to come back to the committee, so it's up to the committee to make that decision.

I give the floor to Madam Kwan.

Madam Kwan, the floor is yours.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much.

At the appropriate time, Mr. Chair, I intend to move a motion to have the minister come back to make up for the lost time. The other times the minister is scheduled to appear before committee are on other issues. This is on Gaza and the many family members who want accountability, transparency and answers from the government, and I think they deserve that.

This motion specifically calls for the minister to appear before the committee for the full two hours and, because of votes—it's not the minister's fault—we have lost that time, and we need to make up that time. At the appropriate time, Mr. Chair, I will be moving a motion to that effect.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

The motion is in order.

Is it the will of the committee to do that?

Does anyone want to speak to it?

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

I thought she was moving it at the appropriate time. I don't think she moved it.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

I'm sorry, Mr. Chair; I don't want to take any more time away from the discussion with the minister, so at the appropriate time, I will be moving that motion to bring the minister back to make up for the time that has been lost today.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

You have not moved the motion yet, thank you.

With that, Minister, as usual, welcome the committee.

Before I start, honourable members, if you want the minister to stop, please raise your hand so I don't eat into your time, and, as I have told members personally, you have your full time and I'm equitable with every member.

Minister, please keep an eye out. If I raise my hand, that means please wrap up, and we'll go back to the members. Thank you.

With that, we'll give the minister five minutes to start.

Minister, go ahead, please.

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Minister of Immigration]

Thank you, Chair.

I promise to behave.

Let me begin by acknowledging that we are meeting today on the traditional, unceded territories of the Algonquin Anishinabe people.

Thank you for inviting me to discuss measures my department launched in response to the crises in Sudan and Gaza.

The situations in Sudan and Gaza are devastating and have left Canadians anxious to bring their loved ones to safety. It's also not lost on me that the humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza continues through Ramadan, a holy time meant to be cherished with family and friends.

After fighting broke out in Sudan last spring, my department responded by supporting the assisted departure of Canadian citizens, permanent residents, locally engaged staff and their families.

Despite challenges keeping Canada’s embassy and Visa Application Centre in Sudan running, we’re continuing to process applications from Sudan through our global network.

We’ve prioritized applications for temporary and permanent residence, including refugee applications. We also waived most fees for Canadians and permanent residents who need replacement documents and other assistance to leave Sudan.

Sudanese nationals who want to stay in Canada during the conflict can apply to change or extend their temporary resident status, free of charge through October.

Recently, we also launched a humanitarian pathway to permanent residence for people living in Sudan, where the conflict began, including non-Sudanese nationals. Their Canadian family will support them here and help them integrate, with the assistance of our settlement services.

Every crisis requires a tailored and different response, and the situation in Gaza calls for Canada to respond in ways that meet the unique demands of those on the ground seeking refuge.

We’ve prioritized permanent resident applications from the region within most family-based streams. And for Israelis and Palestinians in Canada who feel unsafe returning, we’ve waived fees to change or extend their temporary resident status, including applying for study and open work permits.

Many Canadians remain, understandably, deeply worried for their extended family in Gaza. In January, we launched measures to offer them a temporary safe haven here. Family members holding Palestinian passports can apply for temporary resident visas, and their Canadian family will support them for a year once they arrive. They'll also have access to interim federal health coverage and, obviously, federal settlement services.

The policy has, up to now, been currently accepting 1,000 applications into processing, and as we monitor the situation, we're evaluating the needs to update that response and to increase the application of people who are covered by our measures. I do not have a specific additional number to offer the committee today, but members should be aware that our teams are working on it. In the past couple of weeks, we have started to increase the number of codes being issued to people seeking to exit Gaza. We can get into this in the question and answer period.

Usually, applicants need to submit fingerprints and a photo before they can be moved out of a country. However, since my department has no presence in Gaza to collect biometrics, applicants provide enhanced biographic information on their forms. This allows us to do preliminary security screening while they're still in Gaza so that we can finalize their applications faster once they leave. Biometrics are then collected in Cairo.

This is standard practice in crises where we have no presence on the ground. This is something we used in Afghanistan as well.

We’ve heard concerns about the form, so we’ve altered or removed some questions. And since we know applicants may not have access to all the required documents, I’ve directed my department and officers to be flexible and assess each situation case-by-case.

As you're aware, movement out of Gaza remains limited and out of Canada's control. Though I'm frustrated by this, I can only imagine the desperation families in Canada must feel as they wait for their loved ones to come. I know many are gathered here physically today and are feeling that.

We are also working with local authorities at every level to make sure people's names who we've submitted are approved to exit Gaza. We'll leave no stone unturned in our campaign to have families safely reunited with their families in Canada.

Thank you very much.

I'll be happy to answer your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you, Minister.

Before I go to the round, I welcome two members here. Mr. Erskine-Smith is here online and we are also joined by Mr. Morrice. It's my understanding that Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe will share his time with Mr. Morrice at some point in time.

With this, I will go to the first round.

Mr. Kmiec, you have six minutes. Please go ahead.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Minister.

I'm going to start with just a simple numbers question, Minister. Can you give us an update on both programs, Sudan and Gaza, and tell us how many individuals have come in through those programs, and then, separately, how many individuals have come in through all government programs from the region due to the conflict?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

The program in Sudan, first off, as of March 13—a few days ago—has received 2,667 applications. Three hundred and six applications representing 689 persons have been accepted into this.

When it comes to people who have come since the crisis and the terrorist attack on October 7, there have been, in various measures together—I'll put them all together and then I'll break them down, Tom, into the specific pathway, which is obviously limited to 14 people—physically from Israel 1,661 people who were evacuated. There have been 839, which includes Canadians and permanent residents, from Gaza itself, and 79 individuals from the West Bank.

We have currently accepted, as part of the temporary public policy, 986 complete applications into processing. As of March 4, 2024, there have been 14 people who have taken matters into their own hands and have been successfully able to exit the Rafah gates. That number, as I mentioned earlier, is 14.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

For my next question, Minister, you said that 14 exited through the Rafah crossing on their own. Is that correct?

Out of those who have had their applications accepted for both programs—Sudan and Gaza—how many have physically come to Canada?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

With respect to Sudan, I believe the answer is zero. This program was just launched. We expect them to land physically, we hope, later in the year or early in 2025.

There are some nuances to be drawn here. There are a number of people, over the December period and January through to March, who we have been able to extract on an ad hoc basis. Two children and a woman under dire, medically exigent circumstances, we were able to get to Cairo for the medical procedure in question.

Some of them have come to Canada, but the number is very limited and negligible compared to the ambition of this program.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

Minister, can you provide, for both programs, those with approved applications and which country they're in right now?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

We could provide that to you at a later date.

With respect to the program that we launched for family members in Gaza to exit, those people are largely still situated in Gaza, with the exceptions that I mentioned.

In Sudan, it's largely Sudan, but there could be other countries where they are physically present, currently.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

I went to look at the UNHCR's update for the Sudan emergency response. They provided numbers from Egypt. It says there are 508,827 people, according to UNHCR, who have fled Sudan.

They're claiming that about half a million of those people are Sudanese nationals. Then 8,827—again, these are their numbers—are individuals of other nationalities who have crossed into Egypt between April 2023 and March 2024. These are numbers that the UNHCR has received from the Government of Egypt.

Out of that group, how many of those have applications approved to come to Canada?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

I couldn't tell you that, but we could get you that number at a later date.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

That's fine.

What is the security interaction? Have you spoken to your counterpart in Egypt?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

Our officials do coordinate on an active basis.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

Is it only happening at an officials level? Is there no minister contact?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

With respect to Egypt, yes, it's officials.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

Okay.

In the case of Israel...?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

I have spoken with the ambassador, in particular. Obviously, our heads of mission have spoken.

The Prime Minister, on a number of topics, has spoken to Mr. Netanyahu, as well as Benny Gantz and others.

That's not to mention the work that Minister Joly does as part of her job.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

What about the case of the Palestinian Authority?